Playing KB at an NH Facility etc,etc,..

I'm sure there are things you like or dislike about each player pro/con, stage presence, dress, playing style, presentation, equipment used, song selection, etc, etc, there are no rules,..I always said watching others perform is a true learning experience,....absorb and recreate,....everyone learns from each other out there!! Here's myself jamming with Joe Lee on guitar (RIP), Joe Ayalla keyboard, (RIP), with Don Mason & Hank (RIP) in Shreveport, Louisiana at the jam about 8 years ago so much fun and yes I learned alot from all these great musicians also, hope to do it again soon....

I'm not that fat now!

Same here tryin to stay trim for the ladies also

Thanks for sharing, Donny. It is great to see my friends in action.

Your very welcome Bernie.....remember,...

Sharing = Learning

Fran Carango rockin the Jersey Shore..

Great finds Donny.
Here is another one of the 4th guy you posted.
What KB is this?
Thanks
Eric

Eric looks like a Roland EM2000
https://www.roland.com/us/products/em-2000/



And notice Pater Baartmans is doing the demo for Roland!!..

Cool
Thanks
Eric

The NH etc. competition up here in little Rhody is a LOT stronger than that ...

... not judging ... just sayin'

Pretty strong down here too, Tony. Lots of very talented nite club entertainers have long since switched to the NH circuit, if for nothing else better pay and daytime working hours. That was the main reasons Joe Ayala and myself switched many years ago. Getting home at 2 a.m. and dealing with drunks just isn't a lot of fun.

Gary

And now "Tribute Acts" are popping up all over and in the
Nursing Homes!!

Ditto! We are all jammed into a small state smaller than many counties in the state of Florida.

“Be so good they can't ignore you.”

PLEEEEEASE... make it stop.

Donny, of all the vids you posted above, the best was our own Larry. Most of the others failed to make eye contact with the audience, while Larry maintained constant eye contact with his audiences. Additionally, Larry is a true entertainer. He schmoozed with his audiences constantly, while the others just seemed to go through the motions and play instrumental renditions of old songs with no vocals, or poor vocals at best. One more thing. Larry was properly dressed for the occasion. Shark looking shirt and tie, black slacks, shiny shoes, clean cut look. All of these things amount to what I consider a true entertainer and deserve the top pay rates. Larry Levin gets good marks in all the top categories of the entertainment world.

Great job, Larry, I'm proud to say I know ya,

Gary (The old retired guy.)

Larry did look good, and sounded great too!

So I see we are all learning from watching and that was my point, not to nit pic who was better then the other,.......I have to be honest although Larry's were well done my only dislike is the look of the type of headset mic which is totally blocking his mouth and face bouncing around etc,.. and I guess I'll never be a fan of using it. I could see someone at least using the Countryman H6 headset mic as it's so much less obtrusive on stage giving the performer a much better stage presence imo.

http://www.countryman.com/h6-headset

Having tried two versions of the Countryman 6, I can assure you that it was probably the worst vocal mic I ever tried. Feedback was horrendous, it sounded tinny and had absolutely no depth or body at all. And, the price was ridiculous.

As for the headset mic blocking your face, it is much, much smaller than any handheld, which blocks much, much more of your face. Donny, you have said this many times and it is totally false. Take a look at your own videos and compare them to mine or Larry's. The headset mic is the size of a quarter, while the handheld is the size of a lemon at the very least, and that's without a windscreen. Additionally, most headset mics, including my Crown CM-311A sits at the bottom of the lower lip and at most blocks the lower lip and a small portion of the chin. A handheld blocks the entire chin. Some folks have sufficient vocal control to use a headset mic, and some DON'T!

The only change I made to my headset mic was to spray the mic with flesh color paint, which pretty much made it invisible to the audience. You could do that with your handheld as well, but it will still block out a lot of your face.

One more thing about Larry on stage. He's constantly moving to the beat of the song, interacting with the audience's emotions and getting them stirred up with the music. When you move on stage, this often makes them want to climb out of those chairs and dance, which is a great thing for them emotionally and physically. A good AD will get up and dance with some of them as well and encourage them to get out of those chairs. I had ADs form conga lines while I performed Hot Hot Hot, lines that snaked round the room and out into the corridors. You cannot do that when you are chained to a handheld mic! The headset mic allows the freedom of movement that the handheld takes away from an OMB entertainer. The only difference is what some refer to as the proximity effect, which some singers insist they must have. When you have good vocal control you just don't need the proximity effect, though. Garth Brooks came up with the best mic ever, especially for OMB entertainers, with the Crown CM-311A. That Countryman E6 is a great mic for some bible thumper standing in front of a pulpit and singing along with his choir.

Of the three photos below, the guy at the top, a have guitar will travel guy, who's face is mostly blocked by his handheld mic. In the photo of me, very little of my face is blocked with the CM-311A, while UD below is not singing at the time, but imagine how much of his face will be blocked when he moves in front of the mic to sing.

Gary

Gary I just cant come to grips that a $600.00 headset mic like the "Countryman H6" isn't fantastic,...That said personally I would never use a headset mic of any kind and most Power Singers I know of including Uncle Dave, Don M, etc, solo or in bands always use a hand held it simply looks so much better and the ability to manually self control the nuances of the mic in your vocals while your singing is the standard for the business as a pro singer.
I don't knock anyone that uses it but Is just not my cup of tea..sorry

ps hope yur feelin better day by day buddy


http://www.countryman.com/news/countryman-isomax-headset-mics-on-tour-with-dolly-parton/

http://www.countryman.com/

http://microphonegeeks.com/7-best-headworn-mics-for-wireless-systems-review/

I hope he gets paid a LOT to dress up in that outfit !!!

Donny, the only thing I can provide about the Countryman E6 was my own, personal experiences, which were not at all good. I have also tried several other brands and never got the results I got with the Crown CM-311A, which was designed by Garth Brooks.





AS for looking more professional, it ain't the mic that makes you look professional - either you do or you don't!

Gary

If you want to see a pro that has great Hand Held Mic Technic watch Johnny sing this tune from 2:30 till the end of the song!!!...
just a memorizing stage presence, what an amazing singer wow!!

I'm just saying a hand mic requires a certain amount of attention directed towards it because your voice has to go into it obviously. Pro Artists can use this to give certain nuances to performances in regards to the strength of their voice. A headset allows you to bounce around but you're not going to have any control over how far that mic travels from your mouth at any given point. It also can be annoying to wear for some.
That said can we get back to Nursing Home performing etc,etc, and how we can learn from each other.? just sayin'...

Donny, that mic is an omni directional mic. It is NOT a super-cardiod or hyper-cardiod mic like those used by the pros today. He could hold it at his waist and it would still pick up his vocals because he had a very powerful voice. If he were using one of today's high quality mics, no one would even be able to hear him with the mic that distance from his mouth. His professionalism is more than just the way he holds the mic. His appearance, attire, the way he moves on stage and interacts with his audience is what makes him a pro - not the mic! On this we must agree to disagree my friend.

Gary

Its certainly a while ago but tha fact remains its the technic of a handheld vs one of those headset rigs,nothing will change that for a pro singer, headset mics work better if you dance, sing, or need your hands to perform,........if they were that popular you would see them on every pro singer but you don't and there is a reason for that as shown in the demo of johnny mathis and countless others..........

Donny, the Crown CM-311A is the most popular headset mic in the world. Not just Garth Brooks, but a huge number of other vocalist exclusively use this mic. As I have said many times in the past, some folks have the ability to utilize vocal control and some folks do not. Most of the do nots, which includes a number of top vocalist, do NOT perform using an instrument. They usually have an entire orchestra or band behind them - all they do is sing. They do not play the guitar, organ, arranger keyboard, drums, etc...

I learned vocal control many, many years ago when I was a news caster for a Baltimore radio station. We wore a headset mic and were able to phrase our voice in such a manner to place emphasis on certain parts of a sentence that made the stories we broadcasted interesting - just the same as phrasing does for most songs. Without this type of phrasing the songs would fall flat on their face. Power singers do this by pulling the mic away, thus creating a proximity effect to place emphasis on certain words or phrases within a song. Not everyone needs to do this, and professional broadcasters, newscasters, and those doing voice overs for commercials do not use the proximity effect. I have made dozens of commercials, some for major auto dealerships in the Baltimore metro area, and used a headset mic for every one of them. I was paid very, very well to do this because I had, what many considered, excellent vocal control.

Unlike many folks on this forum, I actually took a course on improving my vocals and broadcasting skills at the local community college called "Voice And Articulation." It was a 16 week course, 3 nights a week with a gal named Marry Anne Pastilak, who was a great jazz singer in the Baltimore metro area. She taught me a lot, and I was aptly rewarded, both financially and mentally. Not only did I learn breath control, I also learned how to be a better newscaster, a sportscaster and be very comfortable using a headset mic. She quickly noticed that I needed help on my phrasing and diction. Most non-pro singers never think about diction, but it is probably one of the most important aspects of singing. How many entertainers have you heard that slur their words? Lots, I suspect. I never really thought about it until she pointed it out to me. While Carol and I were in Memphis I talked with a lady that taught diction to many of the greats, including Elvis, Strisand, and a host of country singers. She had a 2 year waiting list to get into her course. Many of her students used headset mics and played guitar - not handhelds.

Now, there are lots of folks on this forum, and others, that call themselves power singers. Essentially, they sing loudly into the mic, pulling the mic away or backing away from the mic, especially when they try to reach those high notes that are often nearly out of their vocal range. Nothing unusual - I've seen this hundreds of times. However, that same person does not have the vocal control to use a headset mic. Don Mason tried it, you have tried it, and many others have as well, and all met with marginal success at best. Nothing wrong with that. Not everyone has the ability to control their vocals in this manner. It does not make them more, or less, professional.

From my perspective, professionalism in music is far more than the type of mic that someone uses. In fact, that's the least common denominator. Not only does a pro entertainer have to have the ability to sing and perform on stage, they, IMO, must provide their audiences with the correct emotional appearance, dress for the occasion, have the ability to read the audience, have the ability to communicate with audiences of all ages and backgrounds, both from a vocal performance, and an entertainment perspective. All of these things are far more important than whether he or she stands in front of a mic, holds it in his or her hand, or wears it on their head. As for the mic blocking the face, a large headset mic is about the size of a .50 cent piece, while most handhelds are about the size of an ice cream cone with a double scoop. NO CONTEST!

Now, when I saw both you and UD on stage in New Jersey and Philadelphia, you both had that handheld mic touching your lips, completely blocking the entire bottom of your face. Your videos of yourself show this as well. You can readily see how much the headset mic blocks my face and Garth Brooks face. There is no comparison. In Larry's video, the same is true. Very little of his face is blocked by the mic, thus his facial expressions are clearly communicated to the audiences.

Not everyone is comfortable wearing a headset mic. You, Don Mason, and many others on this forum are clearly in that category. This doesn't make you wrong, or me wrong. It's just a matter of personal preference and comfort. Keep in mind that if I agreed with you, I would just as wrong as you are.

All the best,

Gary

Concert videos are poor examples.... Fact is, including all the videos above.... they use Omni directional mics..

The sound guys do not want to depend on the singers... they need the control, so Omni directional works best..
Can you imagine motioning to the artist to get closer to his mic ... during a concert

It doesn't matter where they move the mic, the sound guy has all the control..

It would be a total nightmare to have the singer in control... other than their vocal ability.

Active entertainers have no choice, they move around or dance and can't be close to a fixed mic.. they need a headset... and it needs to be wireless... you can find a zillion artist in this category too..

Madonna as an example.. or any broadway show..

http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/1876298/Re_Headset_Mics_Love_em_or_Hat

Fran, I agree 100 percent!

Gary

Gary, I hate that dated picture of me, and I'm asking you to please take it down. I don't want anyone posting pictures that I do not first approve. Thanks.

+1 +1 +1 +1 +1

Donny......I'm not sure why you posted a series of Grade B and C OMB's, but thank goodness this post went South.

But, the one thing I did get from (wasting 30 minutes of my life) watching each one is noticing.......they're all generic......all interchangeable....all doing nothing extraordinary......all doing the same interpretations of what they think a OMB does.

There is no creativity present in any of them. They play music and sing.....one song at a time. They read charts (very unprofessional). They don't talk much "with" their audience.....rather they talk AT an audience. They're not aware a good OMB performance is not playing a single song, stabbing at the chords, singing here and there, an occasional remark. It's a total integration of all of that, and it's done out of your head......impromptu as you go along, with no dead space anywhere.

Is it any wonder people think twice when it comes to hiring a OMB.

Bill wrote the following a while back:

"if a keyboard arranger player started using full styles they would be unlikely to get another gig, as the owners would just turn round and say what’s the point as I can just stick a tape on and get the same at a much lower price.

Another thing with the UK & Europe is that they are heavily into medleys so playing on the fly is a must, (Songbooks and full styles just get in the way) with most medleys needing to be created to what the crowd wants at the time. (They also like to see the player doing something not just pressing buttons unless he is been hired as a DJ)

Finally home arranger players that use styles to sound good at home don’t want to hear pro players using full styles but prefer to hear what the musician can do with the board. (They will usually walk out or ignore the player if he uses the stuff they can play themselves at home by pressing a button)."

+1 x 1000.

I also agree with UD that splashing a private individual's picture all over the internet without their permission is a definite no-no, especially if you identify them by name (and/or they're in Witness Protection ).

I also agree with Mark's observations; in fact, if that's a sample of what I can expect for entertainment when I get shipped to a nursing home, then Please God, kill me now.


chas

Sorry, Dave. Can't take it down at this point, but you can ask Nigel to do it. I didn't realize that I needed your permission to post a photo of you from 20 years ago. Do I need to send you a royalty check as well? I would have posted something newer, Dave, but that photo was taken the last time I saw you, which was when you were playing at the Rib Shop on the beach in New Jersey.

Chas, in reality, you don't need someone's permission to post a photo of them, that is unless they are committing a crime - then all bets are off and they can file a law suit against you. Of course, that doesn't count if it's a security video or a body cam on a police officer. Naturally, there are exceptions to this regulation, whereas some municipalities, such as NYC requires two consent forms in order to publish a photo, but then again, the New York Times seems to get around this all the time. Damned laws are really stupid and confusing.

If anyone wishes to post of photo of me, taken during any time of my life, feel free - I have no objections and no vanity.

Gary

UD have a lot of pics at his webpage, so if he is too shy to be seen here, just take look at https://www.boydsongs.com/photos ...

But those are photos HE has posted, not someone else ...
just sayin' ...

Tony, photos of me have been plastered all over the world, on the internet, on sporting journals, fishing magazines, newspapers, etc... I didn't give anyone permission to do this, and to be perfectly honest, I was damned well flattered that the photographers thought enough of me to published them. Same holds true for my wife and children. They too have had their photos published many, many times, and they too were flattered to have those photos appear. Maybe Dave has some vanity thing with that particular photo, but for the most part, the only difference I see is he was 50 pounds heavier and had more hair - other than that, judging by his web site photos and avitar photo, he really hasn't changed in appearance much during that time. What's the big deal. The photo I posted was just to demonstrate how much of a persons face is covered with headset v/s handheld mics. Nothing more - nothing less.

Gary

chas ... is that you - PRAYING ?!?

Back to the OP ... I agree that the 'quality' of performance of several of OMBs shown in the above posts is not great, and I believe I at least implied that when I stated that the OMB competition in RI is a lot stronger than that.
However, I find it very interesting that some people feel that if someone is not performing the way "I" perform, they are doing it wrong ... As far as reading charts being 'unprofessional', "professional" performers do that today and have been doing that forever, whether they use cue cards, monitors, music sheets, tablets or iPads ...
And why does a performance have to be 'impromptu'? ... Do "professional" performers go on stage without knowing what they are going to do? ... most of us know our audiences and the people who hire us know us and the type of music we perform (which is why they hire us in the first place), so what is wrong with having a 'playlist'? ... when I prepare for a performance, I will have my primary playlist for that gig, and an 'alternative' list as well, just in case I need something else - very seldom do I have to go to the 'alternative list' ... and, yes, often I have to respond to a request called out by someone in the audience which is usually not a problem ...
I agree that 'medleys' are a good thing, and I often prepare them based on a certain songwriter, performer, time of year(season), holiday, whatever ... But I also see nothing wrong with playing one song at a time ...

So I guess what I am driving at is that there is no ONE WAY to perform - do what works best for YOU and please your audience! ...

Gary .. I'm not going to get into a pi$$ing match over this, and if you didn't mind yours and your family's pictures being published, that's fine, but I think it is an individual's right to say if they don't want THEIR picture published without consent ...
Over and out ...

No pissing contest, here - I don't care one way or another. Does this mean you want me to take down those videos of you and the other guys here at the Synthzone Jam that I posted on You Tube, Tony? I though you looked pretty sharp on them.

Gary

Yes, I can empathize. Someone in the group posted a picture of me on the Synthzone many years ago, but innocently. I immediately asked him if he would remove it, and, he's a good egg.......he did remove it.

My own reasons are multiple......the Mafia has a contract out on me, my dog is suing me for child support, and if someone takes a pic of me when I haven't had a good night's sleep I look like a Brillo pad with eyes! Real reason......from the birth of the Internet (or should I say when Al Gore invented the Internet) I learned NOT to put ANY personal information on the Net. Pics, phone #'s, real name, email address, residence address, the state or the country even. Too many scammers and ID scavengers!

I'm sure Dave had his own reasons for not wanting the pic posted and I think he should have been consulted first.......along with anyone else who is about to get their picture posted. Lucky for me the member here who posted MY pic was very understanding and respectful. And, years later, he's still.......a good egg and a favorite member of the group.

Mark

I keep forgetting to mention Donny's latest "signature."

"Be so good they can't ignore you.”

Simple, but powerful!

I've had one saying that I've lived by as long as I can remember.

You can do anything you want in this world as long as......

a) it's not criminal
b) you don't affect anyone else in any way by your actions

thanx Mark and so true it is....

Gary is this the Crown CM-311A Mic your talking about shown?.....
I can see it works very well for you and that's great,......it's just not for every singer. Glad we all have choices....

Why is it whenever I make a comment about a player/players it gets interpreted as "they have to do it "my way or the highway?" There is no right or wrong method of performance, there's just "maximum performance" and I don't believe one can deliver that if your attention is focused on a chart or the sheet music rather than totally on an audience. If someone chooses to think differently, that's fine by me. I'm only offering my comments on what I see and don’t see in other performers. That’s all they are are “comments” and NOT “commands.” Goodness, hasn’t anyone been listening to Donny lately.......”we’re all here to learn from each other!”

Last week I went to another outdoor concert to see a band. First of all he had speakers that were so small you couldn’t hear them if they were set up in a telephone booth and you were the only person in there listening to them. Of course, I’m not supposed to comment on that or I'll have him thinking he’s supposed to do it my way, right? Then the mix.......because you couldn’t hear the vocalist (singing through the mini-speakers), the drummer was overpowering her. But Mark, keep your mouth shut.......don’t offer any suggestion that could be misinterpreted!

But, THIS is what I was leading up to. This man, by his own admission, has been playing 50 years.......and he’s still stopping between songs to find where he put the music to the next song. Talk about “dead space.” There was more of it there than you’d find in a cemetery. It gets worse.......never looked at the audience once or spoke to them even. At the end of each song, he turned to the band to discuss the next tune. All this stuff should have been mastered in his head, so he could concentrate on the vibes coming from the audience.

Speaking for myself, when I’m playing a room I don’t walk into that room with music or cue cards or anything but my instrument in hand. I don’t know what I’m going to start with or what I’m going to end with or what I’m going to play in between. I just know I’m going to stay in direct contact with the audience every second, not take my eyes off them to read any music (it's all in my head), not going to distract myself thinking about what I’m going to play next. I’ll wait until almost the last measure of the song I'm playing to determine what song fits in next with the audience. The dynamics of the audience changes from minute to minute. A few weeks ago, I played a great song, but it wasn’t going down well. I was watching the audience getting restless, and so, immediately, I stopped that song and got their attention back with “76 Trombones.” I couldn’t do that if I had to take the time to look up the song.




Answer.......it doesn’t, unless you’re shooting for maximum versatility where you can change your performance the moment the audience changes their listening moods (which is appx every five seconds)



Sometimes yes, sometimes no.



and what do you do if play list #1 doesn’t work and you go to play list #2 and that’s not working either?



me neither.......I don’t believe there’s any mention in the 10 Commandments that you can’t play one song at a time



Agree again, but it really would be nice if (as Donny keeps saying) musicians learned to “discuss and dialogue” and "learn from each other" rather than interpret comments as challenges.

BTW.....I don’t delude myself into thinking I’m anything more than a “big fish in a little pond.” Always have been and always will be. But one thing I consider myself real good at, and that’s in “delivering” music to an audience.......different than just playing music to an audience.

Well, I got all that out of my system. I write this stuff not to hear myself talk but to try and stimulate more personal music conversation among the members…..not just which keyboard is the best. After all, we're finally running out of new keyboards to compare!

I forgot to mention. I went to see Tony play live at a concert. He's very good at what he does, so I respect the fact that he's taken the time to learn what works best for him.

It affected me, and since I was the subject of the picture, I believe I have every right to ask that it not be used.

Back to mics...
Tonight, just as an experiment, I used my Shure SM35 headset mic, all night. It did just fine. My vocal control was just fine. I used it part of the time with compressor and part without. It does better with the compressor, as would be expected.
The Crown has built-in compression; the Shure seems to not have it, but no matter, my keyboard vocal processor does. The Shure costs $100., about a third the price of the Crown. I prefer the sound and feel of the Shure. That doesn't make it better; just better fit for me.
The audience couldn't care less about which mic I used. I will go back to the handheld mic next time because I prefer it, NOT because I don't have "vocal control". I don't want to have it "on" all the time. Don't want to have to move it or mute it to cough, clear my throat, take a sip of water or speak privately to a customer.
I can see it would be good if one were moving around a lot or dancing. I don't do either when I play and sing, so that is not a factor for me.
If you ARE in the market for a headset mic, I recommend the Shure SM35 as a real bargain. It is fairly comfortable and can be used wired or wireless. It does require phantom power, which the Korg PA4X supplies.
It mic has the same processing as the Beta 58, and with e.q. can sound pretty much as you want it to sound, as can just about any decent mic.
Experiment over for me. I'll keep it around in case I ever get in a situation where feedback might be a problem.

Nice review Don and I agree with all your cons
& I'll add vocal singing mic technic and IMO just looking silly is why I will never use one.
Godspeed to those who enjoy wearing one.

Dave, If I were to have known you didn't want photos of you posted ahead of time, and you knew I had it, I would not have posted it. Guess I'm not a mind reader, after all.

All the best,

Gary

I'm not mad. It's just a bit of a cyber gray area as to who owns what these days. My thought is that no one should post pictures of anyone without the subject's permission. I may have violated that myself, years ago, but that's the way I've come to feel.
Don't loose any sleep over this. You're still my bud.