PA 4X

Posted by: guitpic1

PA 4X - 12/26/15 07:42 AM

Anyone made the jump and bought one?

Thoughts?

Merry Christmas All.
Posted by: Steve A

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 10:22 AM

Yes I made the jump. From never owning an Arranger to the Pa4X.

I was using a Korg Triton Extreme for solo piano & my acoustic guitar to lead worship at the church as a solo musician.

Life has certainly changed....Full arrangements, bass and drums giving me tempo. The people are blown away.

Thet did 2 OS uodates in the last the last month, so they are addressing the bugs people have brought up.

I am too new to know the difference. It has worked out great for me and taken my music up several levels.

To go into service with a worked out set list, intros, etc is just fantastic.....

Was gonna get the Yamaha S970 but I wanted 76 keys and a sturdier board.....Glad I made the jump


Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 10:24 AM

Yes, the second update was a Christmas present!
http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/v...00fe3503d054f8b
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 10:57 AM

Originally Posted By: DonM
Yes, the second update was a Christmas present!
http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/v...00fe3503d054f8b


Don so when is the PA4x coming?...
I know you'll be a happy camper when it does.. at this point it's not whats better between the sound & styles of the Yamaha vs Korg arrangers...it's all about the features, price,...& what works best for you navigationally for your needs as a player, .... keys
Posted by: Torch

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 11:39 AM

So do you use the arranger function for congregational singing? If so, how does it work out in terms of people keeping in tempo?

Thanks,
Chris

Originally Posted By: Steve A
Yes I made the jump. From never owning an Arranger to the Pa4X.

I was using a Korg Triton Extreme for solo piano & my acoustic guitar to lead worship at the church as a solo musician.

Life has certainly changed....Full arrangements, bass and drums giving me tempo. The people are blown away.

Thet did 2 OS uodates in the last the last month, so they are addressing the bugs people have brought up.

I am too new to know the difference. It has worked out great for me and taken my music up several levels.

To go into service with a worked out set list, intros, etc is just fantastic.....

Was gonna get the Yamaha S970 but I wanted 76 keys and a sturdier board.....Glad I made the jump


Posted by: hammer

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 11:54 AM

You bring up a funny point. I once played organ for church services and it was always a struggle to keep the people singing in time with the music. The minister finally told me to just keep playing and they would eventually catch on. They never did!

Oh yes, glad the PA4X is working out for you.

Deane
Posted by: travlin'easy

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 12:30 PM

Deane, I've worked with lots of musicians that have the same problem.

Gary cool
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 12:34 PM

Timing is a pet peeve of mine....
Posted by: Steve A

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 04:46 PM

Chris,

Well, now once I take off............they have to catch up to me, instead of the other way around....

I work the arrangement out so sometimes I will come back at the end of the tune and let the Congregational singing thing happen. I'm Contemporary, but I still know a few standards, but I change the feel and arrangement

I just put together for tomorrow. "Blessed Be Your Name", "How great is our God", "I give myself away", & "Shout to the Lord"....
Posted by: PraiseTheLord

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 07:43 PM

My wife and I led worship with an arranger for years. We found that the key is to have a lead singer who keeps in time with you (of course that could be yourself) and the congregation will then follow the lead singer.
Posted by: shueymusic

Re: PA 4X - 12/26/15 10:29 PM

I've lead worship in the Contemporary setting since 2004. I work out my arrangements a head of time. I sequence all the parts in my Yamaha Motif ES7 and make the mix drum heavy. They follow me! I am also the lead melody singer. Oh, and I play the keys (piano, Wurlitzer EP, and others) live.

You need three things to make the congregation follow you...
Strong melody singer
Chords of the song (keyboard or guitar)
A drummer who knows the arrangement and keeps solid time
---I program all my drum tracks from scratch

After 11 years, I have over 230 praise and worship songs sequenced. After a few years of one arrangement, I do update as I need to.

Everyone else plugs into that formula and it works very well for a smaller church.

I just switched to the Yamaha PSR-S970 to be lighter and to bring my song files in as WAV instead of the MIDI sequences in the Motif ES7. A bit of work to transfer them as audio... takes up a bit more memory too. Lightens my load by 17 lbs. We do 5-6 songs per week... Transfer the Motif MIDI into my DAW takes about 10-15 minutes per song... So until it's finished, I'll have an extra hour or so of work per week. I'd better get started!!

Congrats on the PA4x!!! Enjoy!!!
Posted by: Marcus

Re: PA 4X - 12/27/15 06:36 AM

Just to add my two cents in regards to the last few posts. I am now retired from organist and working with choirs and congregations. I occasionally fill in or play the odd Wedding, a Funeral or Memorial Service.

Two main reasons why a congregation may sing slow or appear to lag behind your playing or lead singing. If the congregation was used to a previous musician (keyboard/organist) that generally played slower or dragged the music. There is a difference between dragging a piece and giving specific reverence to a suitable song. It may take weeks to months for a congregation to respond to a new musician that keeps a more upbeat tempo. A good soloist singer that can keep in timing with the keyboard or guitar is a must as well.

Depending on the size of the church or place of worship and where the keyboard player is located, a lot can happen acoustically as far as sound time delays. When I was training as organist you always hear the congregation a second or so behind your playing. By the time the congregation hears a note you play, their response and the time you hear their singing, you can actually be playing one note ahead of them. If not prepared, the natural tendency is to slow down your playing, thinking the congregation has to catch up, but in most cases isn't the issue. Select your tempo, and keep within it. Occasionally playing staccato can help urge a congregation back on tempo during appropriate sections of a song.

While organ and piano are great with traditional worship hymns or songs, the newer arranger keyboards can really fit the bill for the newer contemporary songs and arrangements. Keeping with traditional instruments or some orchestral sounds and voices, proper reverence can be made to the worship setting.

For me, a full featured TOTL arranger like the Korg PA4X can help my arrangements whenever I would use my arranger keyboard for congregational singing, for both traditional organ and piano, but also up to full orchestral arrangements for the newer contemporary song pieces. Even though I would probably be right at home after learning the Korg OS, I presently use my Tyros 5.

Most contemporary worship songs lean even better to an arranger keyboard, especially if you are the solo musician. I find with a tasteful drum kit and rhythm track, a congregation will follow your keyboard playing better on an arranger keyboard then perhaps playing just the organ or piano arrangement. The more real or authentic the arrangement sounds, the congregation loves to respond.

Personally, I am not a fan of electric guitars or rock type music for this purpose, but maybe there are the occasional purpose that type of sound. Maybe it works for certain situations, but I think not suitable for worship. Maybe in the same way, some people will only insist on only using the traditional organ or piano. Some denominations don't even allow musical instruments.

Anyway, I am a big supporter for arranger keyboards, done correctly, for worship music. The Korg PA4X would not disappoint.

Marcus
Posted by: Steve A

Re: PA 4X - 12/27/15 07:20 AM

Originally Posted By: shueymusic
I've lead worship in the Contemporary setting since 2004. I work out my arrangements a head of time.

After 11 years, I have over 230 praise and worship songs sequenced. After a few years of one arrangement, I do update as needed..



So you use sequences instead of pre-thought styles....I like the sryle method because I'm not locked into a song structure and can extend a Chorus. I will have to sequence certain songs so I can play my acoustic with a full arrangement....Can't play both instrumentsat the same time just yet.....

Do you have any styles that are compatible for my board that work great for Contemporary Worship?
Posted by: guitpic1

Re: PA 4X - 12/28/15 04:05 AM

Occasionally we use our PSR at church to do special music. For the first time, in January, we are going to run the PSR through the house system....we get whomever is there to do the mix. The sanctuary holds about 500(my guess).

The worship leader uses a full 88 key electric piano(Kurzweil as I remember) and that seems to work.

We encourage the congregation to sing along on the chorus. We usually do a country or bluegrass style that has a bouncy beat and folks seem to do well with that.
Posted by: Torch

Re: PA 4X - 12/28/15 10:09 PM

Originally Posted By: hammer
You bring up a funny point. I once played organ for church services and it was always a struggle to keep the people singing in time with the music. The minister finally told me to just keep playing and they would eventually catch on. They never did!

Oh yes, glad the PA4X is working out for you.

Deane


I wouldn't be surprised if some bad singers without the foggiest idea in the congregation said, "The organist just can't keep the tempo right." It kind of runs in the family starting with Adam. Kidding aside, well actually another funny story. A few years back when the BK7m came out, a number of people in our area bought it. A midi accordionist called me and said that there was something wrong with his BK7m and it did not keep the tempo. He had never played with an arranger before. I told him that probably there was nothing wrong with his machine. It was just his BK7m was brutally honest! He just burst into laughter and readily agreed that it was him and not the machine.
Posted by: guitpic1

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 01:07 AM

I know next to nothing about Korg...still reading this thread and others has sure dampened my interest in considering PA 4X ownership.

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=100882

That said, I'm guessing there are many happy Korg arranger owners out there. Don't think the PA4X troubles speak to Korg as a whole.

Rog

Posted by: Bernie9

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 07:12 AM

That thread was from before the bug fix if i'm not mistaken.
Posted by: Steve A

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 07:32 AM

Originally Posted By: guitpic1
I know next to nothing about Korg...still reading this thread and others has sure dampened my interest in considering PA 4X ownership.

Rog



Not sure why this thread would dampen your interest. They did early bug fixes . The first 2 OS updates took care of those. They released those 30 days apart. Most of the criticisms are "wish-lists" at this point.

I can use this live with no problems. 76 keys with a great keybed feel. Looks and plays like a professional keyboard. Styles and drums are amazing. Editing capabilities are pretty deep for an Arranger.

It's an exquisite keyboard that will take your music to the next level.....The response to me after this Sunday's service was they felt like they were in a conference setting with thousands of people.

Definitely a game changer for me as an artist
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 08:37 AM

Yes, I believe most of the early problems have been addressed. That's why they held up shipping for several months.
I have one on the way, so we will see soon!
Posted by: KORG80

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 09:12 AM

Hey Don, what are you using in the meantime?

God Bless,
Don
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 09:25 AM

I have been using S970, but it is now gone. Tomorrow I will use my old PA3X. It is sold, but I won't ship it until Jan. 4., because the buyer is on vacation until then.
Posted by: tony mads usa

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 09:51 AM

Originally Posted By: DonM
Yes, I believe most of the early problems have been addressed. That's why they held up shipping for several months.
I have one on the way, so we will see soon!


Can't wait to hear you on the new board, Don ... best of luck with it ...
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 10:33 AM

It left California Monday. It was in Amarillo at 9 a.m. today. Scheduled for delivery TODAY, but there is no way it can make it. It will most likely be Saturday. Maybe Friday. Maybe Monday. Any way, there is no rush. I'll just sit here by the door and wait. smile
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 11:06 AM

Update: It will be Saturday. frown
Good news is that it will be here in time. I have to ship my last remaining arranger Jan.4, so I'll have this one in time to use it next week, Tuesday through Saturday nights.
That's what all the rush was about.
If I DO have a problem, I can borrow my PSR S970 back from DickieT for a few days, but I don't want to do that.
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 11:09 AM

Originally Posted By: DonM
Update: It will be Saturday. frown


Great way to start off the new year Don good luck buddy give em hell with it!! keys
Posted by: PraiseTheLord

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 02:41 PM

Don, keep us updated. I would love one, but I need to keep the light weight of the Pa900; it's been a real blessing to my back! I'll just sit and drool when you tell us how good it is.
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 03:26 PM

4x is only 6 pounds heavier than 900! However, one factor in my decision is that I will not have to move my stuff unless I want to, at least for a while. I'll be working five nights a week and they are closed the other two.
Posted by: guitpic1

Re: PA 4X - 12/30/15 06:25 PM

Originally Posted By: Bernie9
That thread was from before the bug fix if i'm not mistaken.


The last entries on the thread were Dec. 30th.

I'm sure folks will have a great time with the board and as I said...I know next to nothing about it.

It will be good to hear from folks about their experiences. It's pretty cool that the size of the PA 4X is about the same size as the S970.
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 07:46 AM

Originally Posted By: DonM
Update: It will be Saturday. frown
Good news is that it will be here in time. I have to ship my last remaining arranger Jan.4, so I'll have this one in time to use it next week, Tuesday through Saturday nights.
That's what all the rush was about.
If I DO have a problem, I can borrow my PSR S970 back from DickieT for a few days, but I don't want to do that.


Love Fedex. It is at local facility but they won't deliver it until Tuesday! "It is in a bulk shipment and hasn't been sorted."
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 07:49 AM

go there...."grease the palm" and get that PA4X !!
Posted by: tony mads usa

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 08:48 AM

Originally Posted By: DonM
[quote=DonM]

Love Fedex. It is at local facility but they won't deliver it until Tuesday! "It is in a bulk shipment and hasn't been sorted."


That STINKS !!! frown
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 09:05 AM

It does stink. I need to ship the PA3x on the 4th, which is Monday! And I have to work Tuesday night, so I may be truly winging it.
Posted by: Stephenm52

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 09:32 AM

Originally Posted By: tony mads usa
Originally Posted By: DonM
[quote=DonM]

Love Fedex. It is at local facility but they won't deliver it until Tuesday! "It is in a bulk shipment and hasn't been sorted."


That STINKS !!! frown


Ditto!!!

Some years back I bought a Tyros 2 the week after Christmas it arrived at the UPS facility late on Friday, New Years was being celebrated on a Monday, never got it until Tuesday. Fact was at the time I lived about 4 miles from the UPS warehouse, it STINKS no doubt about it!
Posted by: travlin'easy

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 09:47 AM

So, I guess Don will be borrowing his S-970 back so he can go to work next week. wink

Good luck,

Gary cool
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 10:14 AM

I have three options. Borrow back the 970, use Dickie's 950, or take the 4X out of the box and go to work a few hours later. If it comes in time, I'll play it at he house and determine whether to wing it that night. It will be interesting.
Posted by: tony mads usa

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 10:27 AM

Originally Posted By: DonM
If it comes in time, I'll play it at he house and determine whether to wing it that night. It will be interesting.


If anyone can do it, YOU'RE the guy !!! ... keys

Can't wait to hear the REST of the story ...
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 11:19 AM

UPDATE: Now the tracker says it is on the truck for delivery today. I'll believe it when I see it!
Posted by: musicforyourday

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 12:25 PM

we are living the PA4X Life THRU YOU Don looking forward to your comments .
Posted by: iagiob

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 01:55 PM

Hope you got it by now. where is it coming from?
believe and it shall come forth.
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 01:55 PM

who are you kidding Don wink ....
just plug in and go no biggie for us pros right?.. keys


I hope you hate it so I don't have to change my Logo coffee hahahahahah
just kidding,...good luck buddy give em hell on stage!!
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 02:30 PM

Looks as if it's not coming today. Maybe Monday?
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 02:37 PM

FedEx Home Delivery does deliver on Saturday, however doesn't deliver on Monday.
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 02:45 PM

So it will be Tuesday, as originally scheduled.
Posted by: travlin'easy

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 02:46 PM

Good thing it didn't show up today. You would miss out on a lot of good football games if that were the case. wink

Good luck,

Gary cool
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 03:16 PM

True. I'm having a great bowl season. I wagered on seven games--LSU, Miss. State, Alabama, Clemson, Ole Miss, Georgia, and Arkansas. I won the first six, and Arkansas seems to be o.k. in the last one. South East Conference is kicking their tails as usual!
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 03:36 PM

Just Roll With the Flow!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzrhCotSjQg
Posted by: travlin'easy

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 08:31 PM

I perform that song, regularly! smile

Gary cool
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/02/16 11:36 PM

I just heard from Howard, who bought my PA3X, and he very kindly offered to let me keep it another day or so if necessary. Hope I don't need to, but it sure was nice of him to offer to do that!
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 01/03/16 06:25 AM

Originally Posted By: DonM
I just heard from Howard, who bought my PA3X, and he very kindly offered to let me keep it another day or so if necessary. Hope I don't need to, but it sure was nice of him to offer to do that!


great news don....I know the feeling waiting sux especially for us pros who need our gear asap to perform every night....but next week you'll look back as if you had the Pa4x for years,....good luck with it..awaiting your assessment and demos, comparisons to the Pa3x also..
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/04/16 11:52 AM

The eagle has landed!
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 01/04/16 12:06 PM

Originally Posted By: DonM
The eagle has landed!


congrats Don ....cant wait to here your review and of course a few songs also !!!! clap keys dance2
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/04/16 12:23 PM

Opened box, turned it on, tried two of the new electric guitars and they are fantastic. I can live with the rest for better or worse!
Next I will install the update, then start setting things up.
Posted by: Dnj

Re: PA 4X - 01/04/16 12:39 PM

Originally Posted By: DonM
Opened box, turned it on, tried two of the new electric guitars and they are fantastic. I can live with the rest for better or worse!
Next I will install the update, then start setting things up.



More More More!!!...how do you like the tilt up display..
I'll stop there the more questions I ask the more I might want one...
just sayin'.. whistle
Posted by: DonM

Re: PA 4X - 01/04/16 01:21 PM

Love the screen. Just put it in position and it stays. Easy to read.
I've been just going through styles and sounds for about an hour. Quite a number of new styles and the overall sound seems to be much improved.
Of course they left off a couple of styles I use, but easy enough to put them back.
Still haven't done the update, but that's next.
OS has changed a little; have to get up to speed on that.