Ketron Ajamsonic better then Tyros 5 & KORG Pax?

you decide....

The Ketron Ajamsonic in demo sounds amazingly real....
but, in the REAL world is it more proficient "all around" then the top arranger dogs like Tyros5, Pa3x, BK9, etc,....
especially in a live professional stage performance scenario?

Thoughts

Donny ... to MY ears the Ketron Ajamsonic beat out every board at the jam at Gary's ... the drums were as realistic as you could get, and the 'after touch' capabilities are great ... AJ did this one thing with a sax voice where he hit one note and got a 'flutter' of notes that blew me away ... now, granted, AJ was playing through a HUGE speaker, (but not in stereo) but I was playing my Pa900 and Steve was playing his T5 through the same speaker and there was no comparison ... I doubt that all the boards were eq'd the same, and I know AJ eq'd the mixer to make us sound better, but to me the Ajamsonic was the "Chairman of the Boards" ...
Now, at this point in MY career, I know I could not justify the price, and for MY needs the Ajamsonic would be overkill ... but if I were younger and looking to play a lot more gigs, ... hmmmm ...
However, I am surprised that there is no sequencer ?!? ...

Donny,
There are two things keeping me from taking a serious look at the Ketron product.
First, the weight of the keyboard and foremost, the lack of real top level service from Ketron here in the USA. Soundwise it, in my opinion, is a winner.

Deane

I have owned and performed with the Ketron X1, XD9, Midjay, SD1+ and they all sounded amazing.....as for service in reality when do you ever need it?.... and as far as playing arranger KB exclusively 100%?? not any more,.. times & technology have changed the live music performance business in so many ways lately and it's going in all directions even faster for the pro musician, entertainer player. singer. etc, sequencers, backing tracks, tablets, laptoops, arpeggiators, vocal harmony boxes, loopers, etc, ....it's the ones that embrace change and jump onboard the TECH train that survive...that said, I myself have made many changes in my tool box for stage performance in so many ways using different tools for each venue. One trick ponies get boring to an audience IMO. The Ajanmsonic is an amazing piece of gear, great for recording tracks also besides performing live, a bit of a steep investment but can easily be recouped for the pro player.
But for me as good as it sounds it doesn't sound that much better then my S-950 in my hands and that's where the question lies..... Do I really need it for what I'm doing now?...and the answer is no.

Carry on...

I LOVED my Audya and it didn't even have A.J.'s stuff in it. If I were more active I would most likely get the 61 note version. However the PA900 is perfect for me right now.l

Well, from my perspective, all the arrangers sounded great, and none, at least to my shot to Hell hearing, sounded significantly better than the other. And, to perfectly honest, at least from the way I look at this industry, the vocals are the most important item to consider with any arranger. The keyboards ALL do, and DID a great job of providing excellent accompaniment to the guys singing the songs. And, our audiences demand great vocals. By and large, they could care less about the accompaniment behind the vocalists, hence the popularity of Karaoke, backing tracks, midi files, etc...

As it turned out, AJ is one Hell of a good singer as well as a player.

Gary

I am not putting down ANY of the boards that were at the jam because they all DID sound good, but Gary, I LOVE YA MAN, and you are entitled to your opinion, but with all due respect my friend, if you didn't hear a MARKED difference in the Ajamsonic, then:
A)you were out grilling some of that great food you prepared for us; or
2) you had one too many Green Margaritas ...

Now Gary, I'm just 'rattling your cage' a bit, but seriously, I DID notice a marked difference ... How about the rest of the members who were there - am I alone in my judgement???

And, yes, vocals are a major part of our performances, but many of us like to play some instrumentals during a song, much like we hear on a record, and I think the Ajamsonic voices - such as the sax - would add considerably to that part of a performance especially when playing in other than an assisted living environment ...

JMHO

They way I see it, if the money pit were endless and I didn't have photography and now ham radio as hobbies. I would think about investing in the MidJ Pro and combining it with the T5.............and as far as I can see it would be for my own entertainment vs. that of the audience because we all know it's the entertainer not the keyboard. Tony has a good point Ajamsonic was "Chariman of the Boards".

Tony, you totally forgot that I'm deaf as a post - does that count?

Now, I have played all the bars, restaurants, nite clubs, private parties and wedding jobs using a variety of arranger keyboard brands, but not a Ketron product. I also performed using a six string guitar and 12 string guitar, great guitars and during that 20-year period, damned few individuals ever made a comment about the keyboards or guitars - but every one loved my song selection and vocals - and the same is true in the NH circuit as well. Today, at an assisted living center, I had about 20 visitors, some as young as 12 years old. I did Over The Rainbow, and while I was packing my gear, four relatively young, 40ish, ladies came up to me and said I did a fantastic job and they found it difficult to hold back the tears because of the emotion in my vocals and the overall performance of the song.

Now, I admit I only got to hear a little bit of AJs demos, however, at this point in time, it's just not for me. Oh, I can easily afford it, but I figure it will NOT make me another dime in income, it will NOT book me any more jobs than I already have (which is way too damned many), but it will cut into my sailing budget, which is currently at the TOP of my priority list. For what the system cost, I can add 3G Radar to the boat and a 2200-watt generator to run the AC and heat. And, I would have enough for a year's supply of Green Coconut Margarettas left in the kitty.

Glad you guys had fun, and we WILL do this again sometime soon,

Gary

I had an Audya 4 for over a year, it was more in the repairshop then in my homestudio..

Audya styles are great, but pa3x comes close in sound, and allows much more freedom to the creative player,
When you look at the main sounds, pa3x is much more responsive, espescially when it comes to accustic sounds and synth sounds, pa3x outshines the audya
Pa3x is much more a creative workstation, where audya is a great arranger...

Please elaborate further...
this is what players want to hear about..

Personally, I enjoy owing both my Audya 5 and the S950. I can pick whichever I feel is better suited for the job and sometimes I bring both of them.  And of course more than anything, it comes down to the music that comes out of the instrument.

What Gary said is true. But I think the Kentron was a killer. really did stand out above the others.
You have to really appreciate its abilities yourself as the audinece won't know or care too much. And except for the NH circut you better be doing a bunch of stuff as Donny does besides just Arranger playing.

It is the best of the best though.

let me also say aside from simple NH work... as good as the Ketron Kbs sound & I have had many of them that is not always the best solution to the problem,.... for me anyway navigational features is the utmost importance when performing the way I do with lightning fast changes and jumping between styles, Mp3's, lyrics if needed, backing tracks etc, all in split second rapid fire succession between songs that cannot be achieved with only an arranger KB of any kind on the market today.
You have to use other gear to make it all come together somehow..

Donny, I don't agree about the navigation. Other than the lyrics, which I have mostly memorized, the S-950 provides you with all the tools you need to navigate effortlessly between songs with absolutely NO dead time between songs if you wish. However, in order to to this you must be thinking 3 to 4 songs ahead and planning which buttons you will push to accomplish this goal. Remember, you were the one that showed me this more than a decade ago. My dead time between songs is less than a second most of the time. There are times, when I'm using the combination of the MFD and registrations, one song is actually hitting the last beat when the next song kicks in. And while the intro is playing, that's if I use the style's intro, if I need the lyrics, using my right hand I grab the wireless mouse and click on the song title, thereby bringing up the lyrics in bold, all caps, 14-point, black print on a snow white PC screen.

It's just a matter of utilizing ALL the tools the keyboard has to offer.

Gary

Gary ... like you there are many of us here who have worked bars, restaurants, CC, etc. etc. and I personally couldn't count the number of times I have been complimented on an instrumental, and also what a nice sound I have on the keyboard. ... I also think that any listener who can't appreciate an instrumental solo has little appreciation for MUSIC ... to me, as much as a good deal of my work depends a LOT on vocals - especially NH/Assisted Living gigs - I really enjoy doing an instrumental as well ... BUT, I will play/sing according to the needs of the venue ...
I have said in another thread that during one of my assisted living gigs, I was using performers on old TV shows as a theme and I commented on Dick Contino as he appeared on Ed Sullivan and so many others ... I then played "Lady of Spain" using an accordion voice and they LOVED it ... One other thing - there ARE people working gigs in NH/assisted living places who ONLY do instrumentals ... and speaking of instrumentals I wish we had Ray play a few more of them for us at the jam ...

Bachus ... I am only commenting on the Ajamsonic Audya ... I don't know how the others compare with it ...

Bill is right in that the audience generally doesn't care what instrument you are using - or if you're even using one for that matter - all they know is whether or not what they are listening to is pleasing to their ears ... HOWEVER, if I am getting a great deal of satisfaction from the board I am using, I believe that is transmitted to the audience ...

Anyway, I am now going to put on a set of headphones and play for MYSELF !!!

BTW Gary ... if you ARE "as deaf as a post" how do you always sing on key ???

BTW2 Gary ... when you are using a mouse, that's for a laptop, right? ... it would be great if that option were in the KB ...

Yeah, the mouse is a wireless mouse that is perched upon a small platform that I have on the ride side of the keyboard. The weight of the keyboard actually holds the platform in place and no one in the audience can see it. It's very convenient.

Now, I can have the lyrics in the laptop, but even after the cataract surgery, the letters are just too small on the keyboard's display for me to easily see. It would be a neat feature if the manufacturers had a small mouse platform area built into the keyboard, somewhere on the right side. But, I don't think that will ever happen, at least not in my lifetime.

Tony, don't get me wrong, I enjoy playing instrumentals, but I rarely have the opportunity to do so. Most of the dance tunes I do have great lyrics, most but not all. I didn't even know Moonlight Serenade had lyrics until about a decade ago. I used to do all my polkas as instrumentals until about 5 years ago, when someone came up to me and said "Hey, you know Beer Barrel Polka has words to the song." Since then, I've been singing it, and the audiences love to sing the chorus. I don't sing the Too Fat Polka, but the audiences sing it while I play it as in instrumental. Probably a good thing I do it that way, too.

When I perform Floyd Cramer's Last Date, I do it strictly as an instrumental. Not sure it has words either. Well, I got curious, and damned, the song does have lyrics - I've just never heard them.

Now, Carol tells me I'm deaf as a post because I frequently cannot understand what she says. I have a hearing aid, but I never wear it, mainly because it is primarily tuned for high frequencies. Consequently, when I'm playing and wearing the hearing aid, those high frequency sounds are almost deafening to me. And, the hearing aid ignores the lower frequencies, therefore it's almost like wearing a weird kind of ear plug. I've never had a problem staying on key, with at least one exception, when I did Merry Christmas Darling and nothing went right. Dave pointed out my flaws, I think you did too, and after redoing the song, it came out just fine. So, maybe Carol is right! (Damned, did I say that?)

Cheers,

Gary

Audya does the same using Block registrations. It's almost like a mini MFD.

Henni

Here are some more style demos with Ajamsonic......
I spoke with AJ and if you can contain your excitement the
NEW SUPER STYLES are coming in just 14-20 days I am told !! .....
I can't wait to hear them!!!

enjoy

Henni, if for no other reason, from a purely business standpoint, I could purchase 3 S-950s for the price of a single Audya - and both will do the same things, as you and others point out. With the left over money, I can purchase a complete backup system and still have money left over for other business expenditures, such as my retirement account.

Every successful business has backups - including your doctor and dentist. Yes, medicine and health care is a business - a big business. Your doctors and dentists all have their backs covered by other doctors and dentists - most have special insurance for this purpose. If they get sick (break down so to speak) the others fill in for them until they're ready to go back to work.

Additionally, as I pointed out earlier, and Deane verifies, without AJ, there is no Audya service in the USA - NONE! In this business, we need backups. I have all of my gear backed up, another complete system. And, if I have a breakdown, it's an hour's drive to my local service guy, who in most instances, will make the repairs while I wait. He has all the parts he needs in stock and ready to go. This is not the case with Audya USA.

Now, AJ and I talked a bit after the Jam. And, I told him personally, that I sincerely believe if it were not for him, Ketron and Audya would not exist in the USA. Essentially, he is Audya USA in the flesh. We also talked a bit about marketing and other aspects of the musical entertainment business.

For me, I'm fairly confident that my health issues will force retirement upon me within the next year of so. When that time comes, I hope I'm prepared to walk away from the entertainment business and spend what few years I have left sailing and enjoying life. I'm sure I'll play music at home purely for my own enjoyment, and I'm equally confident that I'll be playing that S950.

Cheers,

Gary

Gary your depressing me ...... I think you'll be playing that S-950 well into your 90s & WAY Beyond That ! ...

Hi Gary,

In South Africa a new Tyros 5 cost more than double a new Ajamsoninc Audya. They are around $12 500 to put it in a way that would make sense to you. So Yamaha is in the same scenario with their top end arrangers.

Yes, the S950 is most definitely good bang for the buck and I am really beginning to enjoy mine.

Cheers,

Henni

Is there PDF manual to download for this board?

Yes. www.ketron.it
Choose language. Choose library. Pick manual.

Henni, Ain't it amazin how gubment can stick it to you when it comes to imports from certain countries.

Good Luck,

Gary

Thanks, Don. Tried that, but the Library tag shows only styles and registrations. No manual.

My bad. Go to the site, select Keyboards and Modules, then select Audya, then click on Manual.

You can also get a lot of information at the new

www.AjamSonic.com

Thanks again, Don. Unfortunately, the page size is way too small to read.

AJ, thanks for the link. At least I can see the content of the pages on there.

Hi....
Here https://soundcloud.com/sokratis-1974/sets/new-ajamsonic-audio-styles is some of NEW SUPER STYLES that we have ready, with cooperation of Ajamsonic...
The demos is unofficial...
We working two more new styles before release it...
After few days will we are ready to release!!
ENJOY!!

Thanks

Eventually will ALL Audya AJAMSONIC Styles be SUPERSTYLES?

You can download the manual file and make it any size you want.

Donny,

Hmmmm ... The SUPER STYLES will be available to AJAMSONIC and non AJAMSONIC AUDYA users (finally).

As to all AUDYA AJAMSONIC STYLES being SUPER STYLES, we leave this to the end user to manually update the older styles with the new Audio Drums, bass and guitars - then save with their own name, as we would rather spend the time and resources developing more and more and .....

However from here on, all styles released will be of the SUPER STYLES standard .... and better.

Thanks,

Great news AJ......let's face it your ears don't lie......
The Ajamsonic sounds amazingly LIVE!!!

Ah ... my ears are tuned to the real stuff my friend - this helps us when we develop new sounds and styles. However, I have also accepted the fact that it's not the sound for everyone (no sound is actually).

Now a keyboard that has and handles equally well BOTH the LIVE and STUDIO/Polished sound? Hmmm...

That is human paradox.We go to studio to record, trying to capture every nounce of that live feeling of music.Than we go to play live trying to sound like studio recording.Which is totally wrong if it was up to me..Why playing live if it's going to sound like a recorded music.
A, is new Aydia on the way??

I like that Ketron just keeps improving & upgrading what they already have inside the KB..

Yes i really like that too.....

But i think after 5 years, a hardware upgrade might be in place, a faster cpu, bigger HD, more memmory..... But allowing the same OPerating system to run, with full backward compatabillity...

What does this mean, current audya users would still get upgrades, new audya 2 users would get more of the same and maybe some new features...

Indid in several posts in the past, i was using the audya 4 in combination with the Korg Kronos and my DAW ( ableton / vst ), i never got the time to do the Ajamsonic update, because from the 14 months i owned it, it was out for repairs more then 9 months.. The pcb that controlled the buttons kept breaking down.. They kept replacing it, but never found the cause why it kept breaking... I think engineers at Ketron could never figure out the real problem.. But to be honest, i browsed a lot about Audya hardware problems on the internet, and it actually seemed like i was just very unlucky with having the one faulty unit.. In the end i got so frustrated that i sold it.

The styles quallity even before the ajamsonic upgrade was outstanding, and since we all know what AJ can do for soundquallity the ajamsonic version must be awesome.. I think the standard style quallity outshined my current PA3x, but only in quallity, not in options. PA3x is a beast when it comes to tweaking, not only the styles parts, but also the sounds..

Personally i almost never used the internal sounds of the audya, kronos and vsts just outshined most of them, and so in my opinion does the PA3x. I dont know how much they improved with the Ajamsonic upgrade, but back then i used the audya4 mainly as a rhytmbox..

The weakest point in my opinion of the audia was its midi controll and the fact that it missed out on pc connectivity... But just using it as a rhytm box with its internal stuff was good.

Gary,

Pleae for the contact information for your local service guy so we can reach out to him and attempt to set him up as an authorized Ketron repair center. These are the kind of people we need servicing our equipment - dedicated folks who do what it takes to please thier customers.

We will be expanding and opening Serice Centers within the US in the next few months - including reaching out to previous ones we used to deal with.

More later.

Thanks.

No problem, AJ

Aaaaah!

So some are beginning to see the light, even though it took some time.

I think AJ is doing a great job in making the fantastic Ajamsonic Audya known to all. And on top of this he gave & is still giving EXCELLENT support to anyone who approached him, no matter where they live.

I could not care less for Ketron Italy - AJ is my one stop Ketron guy & I only have VERY good things to say about the way he helped me till now.

And in South Africa a brand new Ajamsonic Audya 5 costs half the price of a new Tyros 5. Talking dealer prices though. No idea what one can be had for through Frank....

So all in all, I have to say that nothing beats the Audya for realism, & nothing beats the Yamaha for the variety of styles being feely available. And luckily for me I have both.

And it keeps on getting better with AJs upcoming version 3 update which I'm really looking forward to!

I'll end with this: Sometimes I put the Audya aside and fiddle with my S950 instead. And then, when I fire up the Audya again after playing with the Yamaha for awhile, I'm once again blown away by the difference in sound quality. I guess nothing will EVER sound the same after having owned an Audya! And it's not only the live drums, it's EVERYTHING, right down to the superior style engine as mentioned rightly somewhere else. There's nothing boring or repetitive about the Audya styles. Man it's nice when i.e. the bass player unexpectedly does his own thing in between, & even so the drummer. It makes everything just that more live!

And the best of all are the audio and other loops that could simply be browsed into any part of any style. It literally takes only 5 minutes or so to transform just about any style to ones own personal liking. And I'm not talking about changing the midi voice only, but changing the whole loop or the whole track of that section of the style. It's like having a separate multipad for each track of each section of each style - just think about this for awhile... And the choices of "multipads" are enormous as there is a HUGE library to choose from by now. And most of these "multipads" come in loops that are at least 16bars in length for each section of each part of each style & on top of everything mentioned thus far even behaves different for different chords too!

Nothing boring about the Audya at all!

Cheers all,

Henni

I like what I hear
Are we talking only about 6 or so new super styles?

Great job AJ, Sokratis...

Thank you my friend Lee..!!
We have ready 8 new Super Styles, and we working two more (Ballads)....
Tomorow I will make a demo of last (Saving_Ballad) new Super Style..
Our Work not stop with release of this styles... We continue and will update the site http://www.ajamsonic.com/index.html with new Super Styles....
Thanks

Sokratis

About Audio Guitars
I have mentioned I wanted to record my own and put into Audya
I know it has special format, etc
Do you have software? Or just ketron.it has?

We have to have this capability. Let's work on it, AJ has to have connections. :-)

They indeed should give these tools to the community... They might end up withban arranger beyound everyones dreams....

People making great quallity sounds and styles for an arranger would help sell the hardware...

However since there where 6 years between the SD1 and the audya release, we might see a new technollogy Ketron arranger by next year... audya released in 2009. Maybe they want to make those tools a feature in their new arranger, one can not know..

There are about 24 Super Styles in this first release - 8 that Sokratis worked on and 16 that we did over here ourselves.

There are also other new styles which are not SUPER STYLES - these will be made available too ... coming soon!

Does these new developments apply also to the new MidJayPro?

Thanks

No Leezone..... Unfortunately.....Ketron factory does not give us the Software and Hardware that need to make this.....

Ok.... Here is the last Super Style of Ajamsonic.....
https://soundcloud.com/sokratis-1974/saving-ballad

The Drums i have programming with EXELENT BFD3 of FX Pansion
I use for programming and mix the Cubase 7.5.2
Enjoy!!

Sokratis, AJ

Great ballad, Saving Ballad

Sokratis, maybe just a touch more reverb on the snare drum only so it's not so dry?

The break at 3:20 sounds a bit off, just with toms near end of break , the timing

BRAVO,!!! Love it , want it

Me too

we won't have to wait too much longer :-)

Leezone all is ready.....
However in this time AJ working to complete the site, and some demos....
I think will release after few days....

Sokratis,

i have told AJ already,
love that "Saving Ballad"
almost perfect, expect for snare drum
maybe experiment with another snare sound, ??
it sounds a bit aggressive?
maybe more reverb?


great beat for LOTS of ballads,,,

I thought i posted this question to AJ earlier but I don't see it up here:
Is CMC distributors no longer the distributor in the USA? AJ is listed on the Ketron.it website now. Is AJ now the seller, the tech support and the distributor? What's going on?

George,
I would like to know the answer to that too! I had zero luck with CMC getting a defective SD2 unit replaced and decided with the kind of support I got from CMC I would never purchase another Ketron product - especially an expensive keyboard. If this changed I might change my mind. By the way, nearly a year after I just gave on up on CMC AJ stepped in and sent me a new SD2 Unit.

Deane

Leezone I am working a new mix with more Reverb in Snare....
But to change the snare is very difficult because will change and play of Snare.......
Thanks.

Gary,

Come to think of it - In registration mode view, the Audya presents one with all registration files available. One can sort this in alphabetical order.

Thus, this would work even better than Yamaha's MFD. It would be the same as viewing full registration files in Music Finder view in Yamaha, which is what everyone wishes for right now. Well, in the Audya, you have it already & it comes with it as standard. And you can scroll up and down at leisure, just like in MFD!

I only really realised the above right now.

Cheers,

Henni

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Nah...

Self Edit: I have to check this out first. Pity I cannot delete this for now...

Henni

Wow Henni,
These are really cool. Pretty darn nice sounding keyboard.
Might have to think about this one.

Deane

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The Demos are great!!

Yes we all know the Ketron Audya sounds terrific in a live sound scenario regarding the overall live band sound BUT, what about in an intimate cocktail hour or dinner music setting where all those power drums and power styles aren't needed.... I would love to hear some more subtle styles also...?

In a dinner cocktail setting.
You just lower the volume that's all....

Hey Leezone you still out there...

You just simplify the styles, by either lowering the volume on tracks or removing them.... On top of that in the standard Audya, where quite some styles for this purpose, and since they havent removed those styles, they are still there..

Easy styles like a slow fox and a slow swing where allreayd part of the instrument before the ayam overhaul, also some nice stuff for piano style playing at cocktailparties and it sounded top knotch straight out of the box..

The Audya, is really an all purpose instrument, since the styles are much braoder usefull then the typical songstyles of for example Yamaha..

And offcourse you can comvert all those yamaha STY styles to Ketron format and use them on audya with a little tweaking.. Its just as much an all purpose instrument as the Tyros or the Pa3x

My friend.... I am working every night in cotktail, and Restaurant of different Hotels in Creta like this http://www.eloundavillas.com/en/Photo-Gallery-356.htm and of course I play with Audya....
Please listen a live recording (in gourmet Restaurant) in this Hotels (Instrumental Greek Music)....
https://soundcloud.com/sokratis-1974/audya-live-2013
Or this https://soundcloud.com/sokratis-1974/elounta-live-2014 that upload today.... I have recorded with laptop and RME Fireface UCX soundcard from SPDIF out of Audya, and I have make a soft Mastering in Cubase 7.5.2

AUDYA IS THE BEST FOR ALL USES.....

Hi,

The Audya has many, many styles that would be perfect for just this relaxed environment. And no, the live drums does not blow one away, it makes everything just sound that much more realistic.

We use our Audya for deep worship in a Christian environment and that should say a lot by itself...

Henni

Sokratis, beautiful music! I'm listening while eating hospital food, but at least the music is good.

Of course if you play a rock-n-roll song or heavy metal it will sound "loud"
But if you play a waltz, foxtrot or bolero it will sound "loungey"
It's all about what you play and how loud you play it

Sokratis, very nice playing! Could you please tell me the name of the first style that you used. It was a straight 8th note groove with brushes. I haven't found it on my Audya 5... Thanks!

My friend DonM thank you!!!!....
I hope to you LEAVE very soon from Hospital.....
Leezone you are right my friend!!!!!... I agree absolutely with you....
My friend montunoman thank you also.... Yes... The Style is a Factory Audio Style from the USB_PEN_STYLES & SOUND UPGRADE_2011
The name of Style is 8_BEAT_BRUSH..... Very Good!!!

For anyone interested:

Case in point 01

Case in point 02

Cheers,

Henni

Nice job sounds great thanx for sharing....

If I may...