Just got my new powered speakers

They quote big numbers in their secs...and they deliver...I wanted something for stereo monitoring and small jobs...These go beyond what I expected...Check them out..and the price is unbeatable...BIG thumbs up!!!

I think they easily out perform the Mackies SRM 350's...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:VRI&item=330308744184

You're right...unbelievable prices. Where is this equipment made? Lots of options, but everything is less for a pair than any price I've seen for one acceptable unit of any other brand.


R.

They have factory in China. US distributor is in Seattle. www.podiumproaudio.com
DonM

Fran, I didn't see a "buy now" price. How does that work? What did you pay/should we pay? Do we treat it as an auction? Did I miss something?

Your bosom buddy,

chas

Guys I can't find a made in ??? tag anywhere on the units or paper work...not even a printed in ??? note..
I recall seeing assembly in the CA factory..I believe I read this on a blog too..
The components are quality..they do not seem cheap like Behringer and other China imports...Workmanship looks excellent too..

But let me tell you over 3 hours ...torture test..playing G70, laptop, controller with VST's..even wide open...no shut downs, no crackling, no distortion....and guess what a pair of these 8" units can handle a decent size room...

Chas, they had a buy now price at $259.99 and also had a make offer on my Ebay deal..Just ask a question of seller, and offer the $239.99 including shipping and they will say yes..

Fran..

They remind me of the speakers from Crate.
Same look-same type of specs.. They were great.. Happy you shared !

Thanks, Fran. Finally, some good stuff from this board. 'News you can use', so to speak. I'm not sure I actually need these, but unless you're homeless, you gotta be nuts not to grab a pair of these (especially after Fran's mini-report). I'm ordering mine now, so everybody hold off until I get mine (in case they're in short supply ).

chas

chas

If Fran is using them in two months time, they might be worth while... No offense, but several things he has gushed about initially have not stood the test of time

I'd wait for a longer term review, were I interested

Not true..when I gush they are for real...I said what a great unit the K4 was..and used it for a couple years..I said what a great unit the Roland Cube 100 were and still using them 25 years later..

Some products I used for specific projects, and if I sold them..it doesn't mean they were less than I stated....They did their job, and I took an offer I couldn't refuse..

Diki , you have me mixed up with Donny..

How do they compare to the well Revered & Beloved here on SZ
Logitech Z systems?....anyone?

http://tinyurl.com/dftw8b

http://tinyurl.com/dxjrd4


For a few bucks more you can get the 10" & 15" models

the 15" models weigh 55 pounds each, but are 1,000 watts each with a peak of 2,000 watts...bass goes down to 25 too..

Originally I was drawed to them, but isn't something I needed or wanted...I already have the big guns...

heading to Wildwood now..with one of the 8" units..try it as a personal monitor on stage..

Thanks Fran, I'm sure there are super...but I'm staying with Mackie...I know I can pound them for years and they will hold up..OR Mackie will make it right.
Lee S.

Pretty sure these have come on a slow boat from China...

Optimistic specs...

If your happy with them, all well and good..

Follow up!!!!

I used a single unit for the band monitor..it did a superb job..My band members liked it so much, I ordered another pair right from the stage...

I was a doubter too, but believe me..they do the job...and yes I am a long time Mackie fan too....but the 350's can't touch these....

They actually blew the mind of my lead singer...we A, B'd it with the reliable Peavey 12"...and it came in second...

If Fran says the're great ....
believe me they are GREAT!

200 watts vs 350 Mackie watts......These can be compared to the Alto 10" powered speakers.Certainly not Bi_Amped Mackie SRM350s on any level. That would be a stretch of magnitude proportions.

The Bass would suck up most of the Amp if turned up. Just like the Altos do. I am sure they will do fine for the purposes stated but they aren't Mackies.


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-21-2009).]

Bet me!!!!!..

The Alto line isn't the same class as the units in question...Have you even tested them?

And don't talk the number game..it is a false concept compared to the real deal...

I can easily prove this...bring your Mackie 350, or even a 450, and I will out perform it with a 25 year old Roland Cube 100...as in 100 watts....The lower rated unit will be louder, more bass, and fuller range than the Mackies...and it is a single amp with 3 way crossovers...

Before you knock anything..try it or at least have the real world experience....I don't listen to numbers and stats..only the results...

BTW: there was a quote earlier that these units came on a slow boat from China...and it may be true, since everything is unmarked , I can't tell...but I know one thing....That slow boat from China also has the whole Mackie line aboard....

Its about the DESIGN not the little hands that assemble them in China.....I am sure I would rather use the Roland Cube over $200 "budget powered speakers"

Some things you don't have to experience. You just know from experience, you get what you pay for. You like them that's great. But it is an intellectual insult to rational minds to claim they are comparable to Mackie SRM350s.

I'm not comparing a Roland Cube 100 which are quality Keyboard amps as Roland has always been known for making great keyboard amps..

I'm looking at a "budget brand" $200 Powered Speaker with 200 single amp Watts vs a long respected brand with a 3-5 year Warranty that absolutely spanks it in every area. I would not use any 10" driver Speaker without a Sub anyway except as a floor monitor. The smaller the room the lower the volume the more a Sub is needed.

Mackie did not gain their reputation designing budget brand speakers, (That was Tapco) It is their reputation for quality and durability that commands the prices they get for them. Hell... JBL EONS don't have the positive reputation Mackies do. I don;t use Mackies. Never did. But I have heard them in action right next to many brands and they hold their well deserved reputation and price.



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-21-2009).]

Just A-B them with what ever you want...I have, you have not...that is real world experience...And don't think for a minute that the name brands are not over-rated...

Guys I passed on a great tip, if you are in the market for small monitors that will kick with the big boys....If it isn't your cup of tea...pass.....

I have experienced all of the brands, and these little guys are A-ok...

BTW: the factory has a lifetime warranty (abuse will void the warranty, such as not using line level inputs..or out in the rain)..This tops my great Yorkville warranties, and I believe edges out the Mackie warranty too..

Curious 'expert' statement, given that the KB300 and 500 series keyboard amps are some of the most vilified in the industry. I'm sure the older Cube series are ok if Fran says so, but the KB series is what most active musicians know, and everybody I know (including me) hates them (look at the dearth of them on this board which consists entirely of keyboard players).

Take what your self-proclaimed experts say (especially those who have no personal experience with the product in question) with a grain of salt.

BTW, Fran. How would you rate the mid-range? I was thinking of 'winging' them out from (line out) the K4. I would normally get the 10's but I think the K4 has enough bass for the C1, and it's 18 lbs. vs 32.

chas



[This message has been edited by cgiles (edited 02-21-2009).]

Chas, the mid range is excellent..The single tone control is a minus/plus 12 db at 3k....this is the vocal range, and they designed it to make as clear as you would like....I keep it at unity 12 noon..Chas you are going to like these el cheapo poorly designed monitors..

Chas, I played B4 through a single unit last night...and it sounded big..

I may take my other unit tonight and play in stereo..

I will turn off my 550 watt Yorkvilles and 700 watt Yorkville sub woofer....and carry the 150 people room with just th pair of 8's....

These "look" great Fran, and at 18 lbs, they are right within my weight constraints.

I'll have to check these out....they look about the same size as my Yamaha MS60s but with oodles more power.

Thanks.

Just goes to further the common misconception...size and weight equal quality and performance.

Ian

Fran, thanks for the heads up. I may have to buy a couple just because it's a good deal.
They would be great to leave in the van for backup.
DonM

Trouble is, there are more than enough small and light things out there that are total rubbish that it is basically a moot point. Small and light no more means quality than big and heavy. QUALITY means quality, no matter what package it is wrapped in...

Well I guess some Arranger players have different standards. Professional Players I knew and know have all come out in favor historically of the Roland keyboard product. I have no reason to doubt them nor have i seen or herd any evidance of Roland Keyboard Amps of any model being routinely "vilified".

If one "hears" a $200 Powered speaker as being great , Good for them. I would not take that opinion as Gospel though regardless of who it is, where they play,or what they play.

Arranger OMB players are a differnt breed indeed.

LOL There are some things one does not have to listen to to know what they will sound like, 10" no name $200 Powered speakers fall into that category.

Arranger players that don't really play might fall into that category, too, Kingfrog

And yet here we are...

Don't get mad, just ribbing you a bit, there I don't dismiss anything out of hand without hearing it first. But yes, I DO like to wait and see what gets past the first blush of enthusiasm before I take the opinion as face value...

Any self powered speaker, if designed decently, will sound pretty darn good up to a point. It is how high that point is that makes the difference. Ever take a piece of stage gear home, and then plug into it without turning it down from the night before? You shake your head and go 'I can't believe I needed it that loud!'... If you don't test gear flat out, you never really know whether it cuts it, live, or not...

True...but I'd rather go with the lighter high quality instrument and/or amp than heavier ones that do basically the same thing...that's why I'm so pleased with the Yamaha PSR-S900 and my Yamaha MS60 speakers.


Not much good getting older and not getting a bit wiser to go with it.

I gotta say, the Yamaha P85 piano midi'd to the S900 has got to be the nicest combination I've ever used.

88 weighted graded hammer for solo piano, and 61 smooth and light action for the arranger stuff.

All/each under 25 lbs...my back thanks me daily.

I usually change arrangers about every three years to stay with new technology, but my speakers are nearly 25 years old...but, 60 watts/side sometimes isn't enough for some gigs...


As I said, these powered speakers that Fran has discovered "look" pretty good spec wise....proof will be in the testing, and if they "perform" equally as well, then I'm going to get a pair.


Ian

Again you confuse humility with talent. What do you mean by "play". Not many Arranegr players "play" a whole lot. thats why they play them.

I don't get mad. I can dish it AND TAKE IT...

I know many "Pro " players who can't read a note. What does that make them? You get paid to play you are a pro? You sell your work on CD you are a Pro? what is a Pro? What is a "player"? Does a "player" ever really "play" when playing an Arranger? Ah never ending questions.

Even I "the non player" would not "play" out for money using on a $200 10" Powered Speaker except as monitors.
Everyone loves what they "just" bought. I would use something awhile time before gushing over it too much. When the afterglow of a new purchase is gone the arts show up.

I personally don't have to hear them. Experience is a good teacher. You get what you pay for. That's a lesson that is very hard to learn and rarely fails to prove itself again and again.


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-21-2009).]

Fran is using two tonight on stage for monitors...review coming soon.

The frequency rsponse specs look too good to be true. That's subwoofer range for the bass response. Is this possible?

Amyway, congratulations.

Beakybird

Well, you certainly CAN find real value for low cost these days. For example the small Zoom digital records H2, H4, H4N, have features that only a few years ago you couldn't buy at five times the cost.
I have three sets of Logitech "computer" speakers, 2 of the 2200s and 1 5500. I keep one in a bag for backup p.a., one for my computer and the 5500 for the living room surround system. All 3 together cost less than many less powerful systems from other makers. They sound great, are extremely dependable (one set is four years old) and have the best warranty imaginable. You just call them and say it's broken and they send you another one!
I have a $300 mini-laptop that is remarkable. Even if such a unit had been available two years ago, it would have been at least three or four times as expensive.
It has a very good sound card, built-in web camera, 160 gig HD, fast processor and adequate memory for everything I do.
I'm so glad I didn't look at these things and say, "That's too good to be true."
If Fran uses the speakers a while and finds fault with them, he WILL let us know.
DonM

Don I have an H2 had an H4 that I hear somehow wound up in Louisiana via New Jersey, go figure LOL All kidding put aside based on Fran's kudos and eventually your's I bought that same mini laptop for my wife for Christmas. She's very happy with it, she was more interested than portability for traveling more than anything else.

I agree with that premise. However those are all "breakthrough recent technical accomplishments. Powered 10" Speakers have been around in their current form a long time. I don;t see anything "new and different in that design which would allow for BASS at 30HZ!!! Anytime I see specs with Bass response down to 30Hz I get really suspicious. Who are they fooling. Mackies get down to 83HZ which is a real number.

30HZ @ only 200 watts seems a tad unbelievable , especially not BiAmped.

The Mackie SRM450 with a 12" inch only gets as low as 55hz!!!

Thats where I have an issue believing I will hear the impossible.....

BTW: Kingfrog, I have been discussing the 802's..they are 8"..you have been referring them as 10 " in everyone of your comments..

As Diki has mentioned, I have tried the economical and modest priced 4", 5", 6.5",8", 10", 12", even 15"...and running them wide open definitely separates the men from the boys...

This Only Factory Direct..has been a manufacturer/wholesaler for decades..They explain how they keep the cost down..They even mention how they arrive at the quality they have..and mention computer assisted in the design...

Get those throw a way units out of your mind....Try them....

I started this adventure looking at a small monitor for in my studio just to hear keyboards...We were looking at the Roland Street cubes, mini cubes, Mackie 150, and the Helicon voice models...The Roland stereo units did sound the best, but the power was not there...they are fine for a small monitoring room...the Mackie had more power (150 model)..but does not sound as warm, and compared to the stereo sound in the Rolands..you can tell the lacking sound...The Mackies were rated 20 plus more times than the Roland, but only twice the volume...The Helicon is very similar to the Mackie, but does have the edge over the Mackie...

Now to this point....After reading the add on Ebay...and reading the questionable stats..I decided to buy the pair of 8" units....less than the price of a single Roland Street, Mackie 150 and the Helicon 300....When I played thru them...it is completely a better unit than all of the others I mentioned..and I will restate..that the Mackie 350's don't touch these for power and fullness..(even though they are 10".. )

As you mentioned the Mackie 450's go down to 55...and there lies the problem..put them on poles and you better have a subwoofer....

Likewise my Yorkvilles are the same..they state down to 55, but still have more bass than the Mackie 450...and the sound is more pleasing (warm)...

Back to the 802's...the bass response is very evident...down to 20...Doesn't seem to calculate that low to me..Never did understand how they arrive at these numbers...My old Roland cubes go down to 38..and they are the best bass response speakers I have ever heard in any unit...They compete with the high power subwoofer on stage...

The 802 has a very good clarity , even in the bass..maybe this is factored into the 25 hz number....It isn't going to thump with the Roland 15" I use...but nothing else will either...

As I mentioned before to some folks, I tested the pair on stage, muting the Yorkville stuff and just using the 802's on the floor...It filled the room (around 150 people)...I don't think anyone noticed a difference..at least on stage we sure benefited from a high volume level...no subwoofer bass, but adequate....Do I have to mention...$240 a pair shipped...

PS: they haven't blowed up ..YET!!!!!!!

EIGHT INCHES @ 30HZ????ANd you want me to put them side by side with a Mackie 10?

I have a bridge in Brooklyn........

But I understand you enthusiasm considering There are those using Logitech Computer speakers for paying gigs. Not even the superior Klipsh ProMedia 2.1 but Logitech..

My God, if a client around here saw someone with a Computer speaker PA, I'm not sure they would allow the act to play a second set.

If I had not read it would have never believed people would use Computer speakers for pro gig. But now I can understand how from that relative standpoint, how those Ebay Speakers can be considered on the same page as the Mackies. I still would love to hear an 8" Driver reproduce 30HZ..Ther goes the Subwoofer business...hell I would love to hear them produce 90HZ. Yeah the Roand Cubw 100 will indeed sound like and EAW/QSC Claire Bros system when compared I'm sure.

I guess one has to adjust the bar to understand the relative view of fidelity around here.

Kingfrog you'd be surprised know how many people are gigging with Logitech Z computer speakers? .....do a SZ search here ....

Kingfrog....a computer speaker!!!! what in the world are you talking about?

For someone in the business you sure are not on top of the game...

Some facts for you..The 802 with an 8" speaker has a larger 50 ounce voice coil compared to the 30 ounce on the Mackie 350, and the 802 has a inch and 3/4 HF driver compared to the Mackie's inch and a 1/4..

And to correct another of your in accurate statements..Th Mackie 350 is 165 watts for woofer and 30 watts for HF driver,,a total of biamped ..195 watts....The 802 is 200 watts...Mackie loses in a lot of comparisons...I would suggest you try something before condemning a product that you have zero info ....

I mentioned a long time ago, I liked Mackie..so I am not slamming them...but I am illustrating by comparison what these guys can do...including kicking Mackies butt...

Don't take Kingfog so seriously, Donny.... someone as knowledgeable as he would surely not overlook the excellent value and performance of the Z5500.

I'm sure they weren't intended for "pro" use from the manufacturer, but that doesn't stop enterprising and clever performers from taking advantage of them for gigging.

It's kinda the same as "home" keyboards like the Tyros and G70 etc. that get used by adroit performers for professional gigs and/or recording.

If there's nothing wrong with a home keyboard being played on pro gigs and/or recording sessions, why should it matter if someone uses a "home" speaker system for the same?

Surely Kingfog isn't that image conscious...how could he be?

He performed as a facsimile of the genuine article, and he was relatively successful.

Ian

I am convinced that some people are "GEAR SNOBS" ... if it's not BIG enough or HEAVY enough, it's not GOOD enough ...
BOSE can BLOW PEOPLE AWAY with 6 inch speakers ... why can't others ???????
Maybe you aren't going to blast out an arena or 500 person hall with these small systems, but they do a HELL of a lot better job than a lot of people give them credit for ... and those are usually people who haven't even TRIED them because they are not BIG enough or HEAVY enough ...
t.

UH no I wouldn't..Not anymore.

Indeed. and I learned what real sound systems were and what is worthy of presenting one's music through. Image is not important when delving one's product with regard to the sound. People forget the SOUND engineer is the most important member of the crew for an Artist. When people cut corners on that which is the ONLY connection between themselves and their audiences I have to gasp. Unless one is playing is a classroom there is no place for any Speakers that can be bought at Radio Shack


Top brands are top brands for a reason. Beta 58 heads are in riders for a reason, I know some players volunteer at Retirement homes and community centers. They play the S900s and use Stage PAS300s. I Understand that. I don't understand setting up a pair of Computer speakers in a professional situation where the client is spending money for entertainment. And people get upset when attendees ask Karoke type questions.

I am not a gear snob but sound is one area I won;t cut corners, I certainly am not going out on a gig without the best possible system for the gig. In our case its the Bose for EVERY gig. Large and small, When we need more coverage we will buy another Bose System. Im not Powered Speaker fan except for monitoring. I find them harsh and very limited in the lateral range and i have never heard on that does not need a Subwoofer.

Noi Im am not on top of the game where people are using Computer Speakers for professional gis. I missed that revelation and contemporary invention.

Fran with all due respect there is no such thig as a 50 oz "Voice coil" (Numbers don't mean anything though, your words)12 "speakers usually demand large magnets of the larger mass of the cone and voice coil structure. In large big speakers, the voice coil may be 2" or more in diameter. IN your case the size of voice coil is not even mentioned only the magnet weight.Large magnets allow the speaker coil to be placed a deeper in the magnetic forces which makes the voice coil travel over a longer range allowing for MORE cone travel moving more air for MORE VOLUME, not DEEPER bass. Big magnets LOUDER sound THATS what I think you are noticing and loving so much. However adding weight is routinely used to fool the consumer as well. The ole "Weight = Qualty" syndrome. I have to wonder how larges in that voice coil......Like a large diaphragm mike the larger the better


The larger the voice coil and especially cone the SLOWER the driver moves. Drivers that reproduce 30HZ HAVE to move at an extremily slow speen. Not something capable of an 8 or even 12 " cone"
.

I certainly did not imply in any way that you were a "gear snob', but I did suppose that
considering your extensive experience in the production of music, that perhaps considering a "home system" for certain venues would not be a stretch....but perhaps I spoke too soon.

You would consider, and have used a "home keyboard" for professional grade audio production, so perhaps you might seem a bit hypocritical to many of us here on SZ in where a high grade "home" product can be applied in one situation, and yet not in another.

I don't cut corners either, and my well finished and equally well received product and my above average monetary compensation for my employment reflect this work ethic and attention to detail...but I use what works best for me, and would not worry about what others think of the equipment I use.

Having no allegiance to a certain way of production has always been an advantage not a disadvantage to my career...many times my straying from the "norm" or "industry standard" has resulted in a more unique product, and because it sounded, or was expressed differently than the other "cookie cutter" methods, it stood out from them enough to get the right kind of attention.

I have experimented extensively with the Bose (they make a high quality product)...and used the system on both Roland and Yamaha keyboards...a single system compared with a stereo setup of the Bose (two complete systems; one for left and right) gives up way too much in sound and detail for my ears, and also the ears of those who are in the sound business longer than I.

That is why I find it a bit difficult to accept that someone with your production values, would not want the instrument to sound at it's finest, rather than endure a one dimensional and poorly animated arranger audio that is emitted from a single Bose system.

A single Bose system was meant/designed for single performers (or individual band members)...and clearly not for the complexities of an arranger/workstation which is essentially a full band in stereo, and it shows it's inadequacies relatively early in the game...the only real or acceptable way around it, is to use two systems in stereo, an avenue I have considered, as I buy sound systems far less often than the other tools of my trade.

I'm sure those who use a single Bose system (mono) are very satisfied with the unit's performance, as evidenced by the several posts here on SZ, but there are an equal number of us that have tried it in mono and found it very lacking...I want the best system possible(and transportable) for my needs, because, let's face it...we are ultimately "playing the speaker" and a single Bose is just too much of a compromise...stereo pianos, effects and other DSP like rotary speaker, are quite lackluster if you listen to the single system compared to the stereo double system.

I don't "hard pan" my instruments so that there is a distinct sweet spot...I pan just enough to separate and widen the dispersal...a single Bose does not let me do this to an acceptable level, and I would consider it "cutting corners"...I know you don't, but it is me and my audience/listener that I intend to please....not you, or anybody else.

The Logitech Z-5500 is an awesome system, certainly designed for another purpose than for "live" use on an arranger...but it works admirably in both applications.

The single Bose system is also designed for another purpose rather than for use on an arranger keyboard...it works far less laudably in it's other role, in my opinion.

I still find it difficult to believe you would compromise your sound, considering you come across as a person that would not skimp in any area of production...but, I'll get over it, as I'm sure you will too.

Ian



[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 02-23-2009).]

Have you guys ever listened to a CD through good headphones? Did you hear any bass?
Again, why does someone want to criticize gear they have not personally used or heard?
DonM

We have NEVER taken the Tyros on a Gig. Not that I would not consider it. We don;t need it. My wife takes 88 every time. If there are stairs she even takes the smaller Casio Previa 320 by necessity more than choice, If not its the RD700.

We had a Mackie /JBL MR system which became too heavy. The best system we could fine fixing that weight issue without sacrificing fidelity, were the Bose. . We DO use the Tyro to create some of the track parts for backing. When Play with her I would take The Tyros but only to play lead parts and a few SMFs I may use use. We already have her backing tracks on a notebook.
We have NEVER taken the Tyros on a Gig. My wife takes 88 every time. If there are stairs she even takes the smaller Casio Previa 320 by necessity more than choice, If not its the RD700.



We do think about what those who pay us think of our gear, but more importantly the SOUND. In they sometimes complain about other acts and their choice PA Systems. I believe one's gear is an indication of one's commitment to superior product and shows they are not afraid to invest in themselves. Contrary to poular believe F&B guys and Entertainment Directors are not stupid




That's a good thing for you, unfortunately we don't know what exactly is a detriment or help to our careers except when a venue extends our contracts or has us back as soon as possible. The Bose neatly falls "outside the norm" but is always received with open arms in fact the Casio Cruise where my wife plays she recommended and and receive two Bose tower installations after demoing her own. Since she is put doors on the top deck of a sea going vessel she did not want to bring ours. They are holding up better then expected for the past8 months now outdoors!! They get the right kind of attention......None.




My largest concern is and will always be. ALL the audience member hearing the EXACT SAME MUSIC. ANY pro live mixer has the same mission. The SAME program heard the same way form anywhere in the room.

I can't agree with small Computer speakers being a viable alternative to anything professional except perhaps in a 200 SF room of 30 people.



What you consider compromise I considered well thought out based on my experience with far larger venues and many professional sound mixer conversations and (monitor pissing matches LOL never forget he has the "suck button"). You will find at the pro level most experienced sound mixers run stereo systems in dual mono. They will tell you that that the ENTIRE listening area must have equal coverage of both the left and right sides, at pretty equal levels to be effective as your home stereo. Even then comb filtering can result if one is not careful but this thing about stereo being the end all is purely psychological based on experiences that happen mostly in small places like the car and the home.

Go to a Stereo Eagles concert and sit on either side. you will pay for the whole show but hear 1/2 the harmonies unequally balanced some of the music missing or terribly unequal in volume. In my early days back in the late 70's I worked for the local IATSE and worked as a Union laborer,cable puller, truck loader and Super Trooper operator for every bands that that came into the San Diego Sports Arena in the 70's,The only band I can remember that came in with an discreetly audio separated system was the Quadraphonic concert Pink Floyd used on the DSOM tour. All Clair Bros and Showco Sound contractors. Mono Mono Mono.... I believe that is still true today for 90% of all live shows and with good reason.

That said my wife even prefers stereo, but again thats from HER stand point exactly between the mix. She is not hearing what those siting way off axis are hearing.
Old habits are hard to break even when the audience benefits more than the artist.


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-23-2009).]

quote from Kingfrog:
I can't agree with small Computer speakers being a viable alternative to anything professional except perhaps in a 200 SF room of 30 people.

Kingfrog ... just a question: Have you ever tried the Z-5500? ... If not, how can you judge them?

I have used them in rooms up to 150 people (some here have used them in even larger venues)and have received numerous compliments about the sound...
In one of the venues I work, I am located in one area, and have had people in the dining rooms off to my left and right compliment me on the music, so obviously the sound is being well dispersed ... Now, I am NOT talking about wall thumping dance bass sounds, but in the right environment they work wonderfully ...

Perhaps the fact that I am NOT blasting sounds out to the audience makes me less of a 'pro' ... but as long as my Country Club clients and their members are happy with my work and continue to pay me "pro" wages, I am satisfied ...

t.

So, Kingfog, you used a "home keyboard" for pro recordings...thanks, that was my point.


I'm not sure how many "arranger" players do arenas...do you know?

Remember, we are talking arranger players and their relevant venues on this forum, not bands like the Eagles....apples and BIG oranges.

Dual mono....?

So you would still use two (or multiple) Bose systems....exactly my point again; one is insufficient....thank you, although I still strongly suggest two systems in stereo to be the ideal combination....I've heard them...I've compared them...I know of which I speak.

Remember the focus of this forum is on arranger players...not playing along/over with a CD using a digital piano...or "keyboard karaoke " as most will call it.

My point was that the Bose sounds better using two systems in stereo...I still stand by that statement 100%.

I also stand by the statement that if you can use a brilliant home keyboard (Tyros3) for doing (or recording or pre-recording) an allegedly "pro" show, then, what's the problem with using a brilliant home/computer speaker system for doing an appropriately sized venue?

No problem for many players on this forum....you can't have used a Z-5500 or you wouldn't be making those statements.

I have personally used a Z5500...it is a terrific system, and the other big plus...it's stereo...not one dimensional mono.

I think you have lost sight of the reality in which most "arranger players" play...thankfully most of us here do not have their feet firmly planted in mid-air where yours seem to be.

Ian




[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 02-23-2009).]

There are three kinds of lies... Lies, damn lies, and specs

A KHz figure for low or high end means NOTHING without the figure that says HOW MANY db it is down at that point. Look at any professional (I mean REAL 'pro' gear like JBL) gear spec sheet, and you will see qualifying figures for frequency range, and wattage.

Frequency is expressed in how many db down at the frequency point the speaker is. Sure, a set of headphones can output a 40Hz tone, but unless it is stuck inside your ear, you would never hear it. Real speaker specs say that it CAN play a 30Hz tone, at -10db, or -15db, or -3db, whatever. Without that qualifying spec, the stat is MEANINGLESS.

Power is expressed in watts with a THD qualifier. What's the point of delivering 300 watts, if it comes at a price of being 30% THD? Power, on 'pro' specs, is expressed as a wattage at a specific THD. Usually, two or more. So, for instance, 300 watts @ 5% THD, 150watts % 0.5% THD. And, unless the amp is driving a built in speaker, it is expressed at a specific speaker load (4 ohm, 8 ohm, 2 ohm, etc.).

Without these qualifying figures, you are reading FICTION

And then, of course, getting all worked up here 'defending' your choice of 'fiction'

Without these qualifying figures, you CAN'T compare one s/p speaker set against another without your ears. Kingfrog, I've heard cheap gear sound great and pricey gear sound like crap. Surely all your years in the business have taught you THAT basic. On the whole, yes, pricier and well known will TEND to mean better. But there are always bargains to be had...

You mix through a pair of Alesis POS monitors. At least, in the opinion of someone that says you ALWAYS get what you pay for. Surely your own experience with these shows that your own elitist position on gear (the FIRST thing you criticize in others, when it suits you) is in error..?

You've got to make your mind up. Either judging equipment by it's reputation and price alone IS sufficient, or it isn't. If not, next time I mention some higher end piece of gear, cut a little slack, if not to me, then to all the OTHER audio pros who seem to think that price and reputation DOES equate to better performance.

JUST LIKE YOU

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 02-23-2009).]

Interesting website to read..

http://www.dt4u.com/dtsystems/speakertech.php

Diki I can assure you I know technical specs. I did not feel the need to go into the detail regarding THD and dbs of drop of at what frequencies for a $200 Chinese Speaker bought on Ebay.(especially in a forum where low end Computer Speakers are considered viable live performance fare)I know you have a great need need to impress for whatever reason. Perhaps you are insecure with your self or where you have gone in life with your music, who knows? However if you REALLY knew what you were talking about, my choice of monitor would be easily understood as anyone who knows anything about recording knows monitors are for REFERENCE and one mans reference means nothing to another, I am sure I can make a beter mix on them then a new set of whatever you want to throw at me. Major producers and engineers STILL carry tissue tweeter covered Yamaha NSMS around. Can I afford a set of Genelecs or another "flavor of the day" monitor. Uh yeah many times over, But why when I have been using the same monitors (and have a box full of replacement drivers) for years and am satisfied with the result? I don;t need nor want to begin anew refencing a monitor. Its more important to KNOW your monitors then to BUY them based on numbers.

Studio vs live....Apples and oranges..Surely even YOU know that? Or do you? Do you see me using $200 speakers live? Uh No.... I will use them all day long in the studio though becasue i KNOW them and I know what to expect as a result of using them. I also know what to expect from $200 speakers in a live situation...Apparently you don't.

BTW one COULD mix on Logitech Computer speakers if they KNOW them. Thats the KEY KNOW THY MONITORS BEFORE the MARKET HEARS....Can't do that wil live speakers...The market IS hearing them.

I know you have been beat up a little here lately and need some cred You want to try to earn them back back from your minions on someone else more respected than I IM not buying your BS and I happen to KNOW beyond any shadow of doubt you don't know it all.




[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-23-2009).]

Just ordered mine Yeah ....they are on the way...If Fran says Go for it....you can best believe you GO FOR IT!!!!!!

Who says there is no God...LOL

They are comlimenting YOU not your speakers....
Think about how many MORE compliments you would get with a better sound system. Good enough is never that when performing live.

Kingfrog...I am almost ready to buy you a pair of these 802's...They have taken everything I have thrown at them..Playing G70 organ with deep fat organ bass..along with G70 drums..Deep bass, and great highs..at a volume that is too loud for 90 percent of my jobs ..usually 150 to 250 people...I was just telling Donny..a pair on poles and a pair on the floor.. would blow anyone's mind...They are that good...They kick as good as most 15"...

I believe the company has achieved this great sound, partly in the design of the cabinet and the matching of components..They designed the tuned ports well, eliminating a rattling and breaking up of sound that is evident on others..even the name brands..

The key is durability..and only time will tell...They are made very well..I wanted to use the old saying.."built like a tank"..but that is very common now days on SZ..

Tell me you would admit..as in eating crow..here on SZ..and put them up against your Brand names..even the 12" models...and I may just buy a pair for you....I think there would be enough of us here to chip in...just to hear you eat crow...

Also ...I'd bet these would be a BIG seller on the showroom floor at GC if demonstrated properly also

Somebody give me a direct link please.
Thanks,
DonM

Don

Go to eBay and put in pp802a.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250371813281&_trksid=p3907.m32&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching

Don, make an offer of $239.99 and they will accept it..

Alright people..Roll call!!!

Who bought these so far?

I know of 5 other people that have purchased so far, but no one has said they recieved or used them yet...Let's hear it!!!!

Chas, did you get your pair yet?

me me ME! they are on there way to NJ as we speak!

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 02-23-2009).]

OK, I bit!

Just bought them DELIVERED to OH for $219.98. Talked to the 800-910-3575 (Sasha) and coming this week from CA.

They sure will be a good addition to my aching back if Fran's correct

Will let everyone know and I'm comparing them to my trusty 450v2s.

But they can only compliment ME based on what they HEAR through my SPEAKERS !!! ...

On your second comment:
If that's the case, I won't sound GOOD ENOUGH unless I have the biggest, heaviest, loudest, boomiest, sound system ever built ... There has to be a point when MORE is OVERKILL, no matter what the venue ...

I am just AMAZED that you can be so ABSOLUTELY NEGATIVE about something you have not personally tried or heard ... but, to each his own ...
To quote another S-Z member, 'Enjoy what you play" ...
t.

King, oh King... What are we going to do...?

The point, which you COMPLETELY missed, is that your Alesis's (which are a pretty decent NS10 alternative) are VERY inexpensive, but doing a job that MUCH more expensive speakers usually are used for. All I was trying to point out was that using words like 'I don't need to hear a $200 Chinese self powered speaker to know whether it is any good' could be used for the exact same equipment you use happily.

Many audio pros would say the same thing about YOUR gear. Are they right? And, if not, how are YOU right saying exactly the same thing? I can see EXACTLY how you respond when someone else casts doubt on your ability to pick good gear out, and yet, here you are doing exactly the same thing...

So, before you go off the deep end, allow me to just say I wasn't saying anything about your ability to mix (not that we have heard much, yet) just your ability to say one thing for yourself, and another for anyone else. If Alesis managed to make a decent nearfield, at a price WAY lower than the rest, then how come these guys that Fran likes can't? Just exactly what DO you say to a customer that goes 'I don't need to hear a cheap Alesis monitor to know what it sounds like'?

Probably the same thing we are telling you... USE YOUR EARS. Then make up your mind.

Sasha is a real person..and can sell me the Brooklyn bridge..

Zuki ..great deal...I had the same price from the factory (non Ebay)..but there was a shipping cost the came out higher over all than the Ebay offer..

Maybe I should call Sasha and tell her I am drumming up the business here...maybe I can get a thank you card...

Yes, a real sweetheart on the phone

Question: Doesn't appear to have handles I suppose being so light, it's not a problem to grab and go, huh?

Zuki go to Walmart Fran just bought the perfect case for these 2 speakers....
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=8586178

Thanks for the tip. I'll see how they sound first. I might have to sell them to Kingfrog

You can carry by the knob assembly on the bottom..no problem....Sell them Mackies..

That's my carry case..works great room for two speakers and a little room for cables or mics..

I load the speakers ..grille facing the front..with the heat sink facing the back..One speaker on top of the other..Also don't forget to unzip the expander..fits perfectly..


[This message has been edited by Fran Carango (edited 02-23-2009).]

Wow! I hope you're right. Those Mackies are overkill for what I play 95% of the time. I do get a lot of compliments on the clear sound though.

That said, can't wait to give them a try. Thanks for the thread Fran

OK ... NOW the truth can be told ... Fran is actually manufacturing these in his garage for $2.15 each!!! ... For all of you who have purchased them - DON'T LET THEM GET WET... THEY WILL SHRINK!!! ...
t.

Did I mention..they smell like a dead skunk when they warm up..


Just kidding..

t.

Fran, Fran, . . . only a total amateur would carry his speakers in a cheap Walmart bag.
You can get the same bag with JBL or Mackie on it for a lot more money. Then at least people would think you had expensive stuff.

DonM

You know Fran and his women - I think he has a deal going with Sasha

Still is hard to believe that these $200 monitors will sound like $1500 450s

Jim..now you are stretching my words...I said they can kick the 350's butt..

but, you be sure to let us know how close they compare to the twice the power 450's..

he must be a "REDNECK"

Their website:
http://www.onlyfactorydirect.net/servlet/Categories?category=Pro+Audio%3ADJ%2C+PA%2C+Band+%26+Karaoke+Speakers

I do use the Tyros at home (hardly pro recordings) but I just bought a Motif XS becasue as much as I tried the Tyros CANNOT cover all the bases I need covered in a home Studio by any stretch of the imagination. I tried but its simply not a DAW friendly WS
Its a great style and SMF playback machine. The Motif is built specifically to interface with a DAW. Transport and fader controls integrated into the board. LAN.Firewire and digital outputs.
We will still usethe T3 for certain voices and to record back up popular music tracks in a hurry, but it will no longer be the centerpiece and is now instead a fantastic sound module and Style Generator.

ONce I get to know the XS in and out which will take about 6 months I probably will sell the T3. I have to keep it a year per my agreement with Yamaha. Then I will sell it for $2500 and stick with the XS8 and VSTIs to fill the hole. (after archiving as many MIDI styles as possible)

Yes I am beginning to understand the crowd here and their curious choices. I also understand why there aren't any OMBs using Arrangers here in one of the largest OMB capitals of the east coast The avg demographic who has purchase the 6 S900s I sold this year are 55- 60 and are PT players who do play retirement homes and very small local pubs and one guy plays the Moose Lodge on occasion. I did sell a Tyros 3 today to a blind guy coming from an S750. He was amazing to watch get around on the t3. Came all the way down from Virginia to SEE ONE!!! Apparently no one is carrying them in stock.

Dual Mono is routinely used in major shows and events. That is where both sides of the Hall are INDEPENDANTLY amplified in bridged mode in Mono using discrete R/L out of the board.

The dual Bose systems on the Casino boat are in 11-1 stereo, but they are only 10' apart. I sold them the system but recommended they only buy one Mod II instead of two Mod Is. The OMB player who bought the system for them insisted they be in Stereo. He has since been let go. (Apparently Stereo did not help his act).

Call me crazy but I cannot come to grips with a Logitech Z 5500 Digital PC multimedia home theater speaker system being used at a Club here, or anywhere. Its a Computer speaker system for gamers. At the very minimum I sell the StagePas 300 Systems to the players who play the retirement home circuit here.

IM glad you find stereo to be of such great help and Logitech Speaker systems as well. If people can make a living with a speaker system like that all the power to them.

The difference is Im using mine BEFORE the public hears the result and I have second and third chances to check my mixes.

Advise me to order a a pair of $200 powered 8" or even 10" speakers off Ebay to play live in front of a clients customers based solely on the opinion of someone in an Internet forum (where Logitech is considered a viable professional PA system) and I am not running to Ebay. The difference is one I get to hear BEFORE anyone else does. The other IS heard by everyone else. Thats it purpose. Diki people here are seriously glowing about LOGITECH Computer Speakers as a professional PA System!!!. How the hell could I not question nor be confused about opinion on anything without digging deeper??

Audio recording forums are the worse for gear suggestions. Unless one uses a manley this or U87 that they are not relavant. I understand. But I also understand their market and mine. They make recordings for the sake of the RECORDING. I record music not gear. There is a point of no return in Audio world. People buy $23,000 Magico V3 hiFi Speakers. Surely My Rode NT2 and VCQ1 are Hasbro products next to a vintage U87 and Amek Channel in a Box preamp. I get it.
I certainly would not recommend 10 year old Alesis Monitor Ones to anyone in a Recording forum who is looking for monitor speakers. I wouldn't recommend them here!! There are plenty of Studio monitors that would blow them away for "new ears" and not require as much a "listening learning curve." They are good for me ONLY because I KNOW them. I know how to EQ a mix through them. I know their weaknesses and DON'T compensate for them.

When they are finally trashed I will have to start all over with another brand and I don't look forward to that day. Believe it or not I once bought a pair of 824s and EQ'd the Alesis to match them (with a Sub) I decided the difference was not worth $900 and took the Mackies back. My system was set up to match the Mackies and they came close enough.

I nearly always track a professional CD close to what I'm mixing when I am mixing as well. If I could get my EQ to match the $100K recording of Sting or whatever playing through the same speakers I was happy and "learned the monitor's "quirks" as well. After awhile I can trust my ears and the monitors. Anyone can do this with a pair of Auratones or RS Minimus 7's.

[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-23-2009).]

I bought a StagePas 300 system. And I took it back the next day. It comes nowhere close to sounding as good as even the Logitech Z2200, much less the bigger one--an informed opinion from someone who has owned 'em all, but just an opinion. Also the effects in it were limited and primitive at best.
When I had my little night club, I had two biamped 15 inch Peaveys, with two Toa 18 inch subs and monitors for each side. Since then I've gotten a lot smarter. With today's technology that sort of overkill is just not necessary and not economical. Even with all that power, I didn't play too loud.
As DNJ says, playing music is my "real" job, thanks to arrangers. All the guys working at the local music store look down their noses at me. That's the main reason I don't buy much from them any more. As a rule, they have no idea what arrangers are capable of doing.
Imagine, I'm rarely invited to their Jam nights where they all get together and play for nothing at local clubs (because they can't get a paying job I suppose). Doesn't matter because I'm working five nights a week anyway, and that's the last thing I want to do on Sunday and Monday.
When DNJ was here, we went out to one on Monday night. We stayed maybe four minutes because the music was so loud it was almost painful. I can only assume it's because they damaged their hearing long ago and don't know any better. The point is, in their minds they are pros and I'm stupid because I have a toy keyboard.
This doesn't have much to do with the thread, but that seems to be the norm these days.
The older I get the less tolerance for ignorance I seem to have. Before anyone gets his feelings hurt, ignorance is the lack of knowledge and doesn't mean you are not smart or well-informed in other areas.
I just don't see the point in blindly criticizing things you haven't tried or even heard.
I wouldn't play a big job with a Z2200, and to be honest I haven't used them since getting the Bose, but there are jobs for which they are perfect. Also, those type of jobs seem to pay way more than the ones where you have to play really loud.
I think I'll order a couple of "Fran's" speakers just because they are cheap. If they aren't any good, I'll sell them to DNJ and he can put them on Ebay after a couple of days, or trade them to Fran and put whatever he gets in trade on Ebay after a couple of days.
DonM

Yeah everybody has different ears and concepts of what is good for them for the jobs they take.

I would not expect anyone to purchase anything because I say its good....nor would I do the same on another's word.

The Stagepas isn't for everyone. I sell them and Passports as portable systems but outside of the 500 watt Fender Passport I don't like them either. We personally use the Bose System for everything large and small outside and in. No need for a baby system. Thats the beauty of the Bose for us.

But all I do is demo stuff all day, The customer makes the choice from there. A lot of musical gear cannot and should not be "sold". If a product cannot sell itself, it's Thank you next. Thats how I do business. I show them and answer questions. I don't "sell" anything. Good products do sell themselves. Bad products need to be "sold". When a manufacturer rep has to tell me HOW to sell their product I don't want it. I can take 30 minutes to sell a VOX amp at 25 points or just turn on a Line 6 Jamman, Demo it for 5 minutes and walk away and make more margin for the store.

Same with the PA50 vs the S700
Turn them on and play show and tell and let the customer decide. The Yamaha usually wins on ease of use alone. The secret is KNOW thy products. I don't know jack about Bass guitars, so I call the staff bass player. The acoustic keyboard guy called me over to demo the T3 today. We all work well and since we don't work solely on commission (ok maybe 3-5%) we can hand over a customer without worrying about losing $20 commission on the deal. Its more important the customer speaks with someone who can answer their questions and speak their language.

You kind of sidestepped my question, there, Kingfrog...

What WOULD you say to someone that said 'I don't need to listen to a cheap pair of Alesis monitors (or a cheap NT2 mike, or a 'home' keyboard like the T3 ) to be able to tell what it sounds like"?

And can you take your own advice? You sure can dish it out.

The fact of the matter is that I'm NOT a 'studio elite' equipment guy. My monitors are modest (824's), NOT über-expensive B&W's or things like that. My mixer is a simple Mackie 1402. My audio interface is a simple MOTU 2408, my keyboards no more advanced than you. Yes, I use some of that high end stuff at the studio, and yes, it DOES make a difference, but not a big enough one that I GOT to have it! My computer is stone age compared to yours. You probably don't want to listen to me tell YOU that you don't need a computer that good to make great music! You need what you need.

You need different tools for different jobs. At the studio, we make product for major labels. They expect it to sound as good as it can. Not simply 'good enough' for a demo, or a bar band CD. At home, I do mostly pre-production and virtual production work, so my needs are more modest. I really don't get too worked up about the gearheads and tech slutz! SOME of them need it for what they do, some don't. I know I don't! But it IS nice to play with when you get the opportunity!

So lighten up a hair. I've got nothing bad to say about your equipment. Don't get so defensive... I was merely trying to point out (as you sidestepped) the inherent contradiction in defending YOUR choice of gear that others would dismiss out of hand, yet dismissing out of hand the decisions of others. You gave those Alesis monitors a chance, when many others wouldn't. So why not give the Podium's a chance..? We are not saying you got to BUY them

Just give them a chance. As you would expect from others about YOUR gear choices.

I'm thrilled you are beginning to understand the "crowd" here and their "curious" choices...

I think why you misunderstand the choices of what most arranger players use here, is because, basically, you are not an arranger player...at least not one who plays "live".

Sure, you might use a T3 for making backing tracks for a CD that your wife plays piano and sings over....but you don't use an arranger "live" like most of us here (not that there's anything wrong with that, but it may explain why it is a little difficult for you to get your head around why we choose the gear we do.

I use an S900 (as do a lot of arranger players in my neck of the woods)...it's inexpensive, reliable, and I can make as much quality music (or more) with it as someone can on a more expensive and/or heavier T3, PA2xPRO or G70.

I make my living playing an arranger, so I am careful with my investment in gear, both from a monetary point of view(I have to make good profit) and from a realistic standpoint( where I can comfortably transport it by myself).

Most of us here on SZ who play arrangers "live"...Fran, Donny, Diki, Gary D, DonM,(to name just a few) are always looking for something lighter, more efficient, and easier to transport and set up( as well as sound great) and when one of us discovers, like Fran did in this case, a easier way to do things, it stirs our interest...the Z5500 stirred a lot of interest several months ago...and so on.

Some of us get the impression (from your posts and your attitude) that you feel you are not on the same path/level as many of us...perhaps that is true.


. It's not that important to me what your perspective is (athough I do read your posts to be fair)...you and I see things very differently in regards to playing/using arrangers (and sound systems) and I really can't relate to your views...if you played "live" and lugged around gear on your own, and worked in the trenches like most of us here, perhaps I would take your advice/comments more seriously....but I can't, and neither can many others who are in the same position as I.

Doesn't make you dumb, or not wanted, or a "gear snob", but it does serve to point out just how little you know about my world (and that of many others here)and the business of playing solo (or OMB, if you prefer).

I guess you do use an arranger in a curious way to most of us, yet we give you lots of slack about your gear choices...why not return the favor?

Ian

Don exactly....my adopted from Uncle Dave slogan "Music is My real Job" is so true....
& yes my ears are still ringing after we went to that Unbelievably LOUD Blues club a few weeks ago....not to mention the freaking wall of thick smoke that you could hardly see the stage........on the other hand NeilFrog can talk all he wants ...as always I'll make my decision with my ears after "I hear what Ya got"........yapping about things people havn't heard or played or won't post a demo of is the meaningless credibility dropping norm here.....all here say BS at best....thank goodness for the delete button. Now if you'll excuse me I have a "FAT TUESDAY" Mardi Gras gig to perform at today!

I had to put my 2 cents worth in here...
With powered speakers...there is a huge difference in True Monitors and PA speakers.

They are designed for different purposes.
Near fieds monitors are designed for true flat response and for final mastering your music for web or CD's etc. That cost money. I use my Mackie HR824's for that and just standard speakers because they sounds so good.

For stage performace my 824's may not be the right choice. Even though they kick serious butt with the bi-amped 250 watts each (x2).

Based on my Hi-FI experience of many years and keyboad stuff today...it's all about the sound AND how long will they last.

If you like the sound and don't mind taking a risk on how well made they are/how long will they take a pounding...then go for the cheap China pair for $239.00. Your not buying them for near field monitor use.

If they sound good turned way up without distortion, have the freq. response you need and hold up...what a bargain.

Sounds too good to be true to me.

And you want to DEPEND on this quality for proffesional performances?

Maybe they haven't blown up yep...how long have you pounded them?

Lee S.



[This message has been edited by leeboy (edited 02-24-2009).]

Lee, most of you guys missed my point ...posting my findings with this product, that is far from the other poorly made trash (10" stuff being shipped)..I wasn't looking for a Super big sound when I ordered these....but that is exactly what I found...For those that share a desire , with a great price to get something short of amazing....these are the people I wanted to share my experience....

For the other doubters (as I was)..just ignore the 802's....It will not be my loss or any of the new to be owners of the little butt kickers....

They are not PC speakers, and appear to be every bit as durable as any other plastic housed speakers...of course time will tell..

If you look at the workmanship and visible components, you can tell they are not the typical trash items...

Be prepared to hear from the other new owners in a few days.......there is a lot more story to tell...

I have tested the 802's at half volume ( too loud to run wide open)...for approximately 20 hours in 4-5 hour intervals..Neighbors 6 streets over complain about being too loud..

I expected them to shut down with overload, like Mackie did/does, and even Barbetta's...heck even the Yorkvilles, but are quicker to resolve than the aforementioned..I seen the Mackies and Barbettas shut down for over a minute....I think they addressed the normal problem with a new heat sink design....Barbetta went with fan cooled...

For now I am still impressed with the 802's..

I don't have to side step. This has happened to me on numerous occasions over the years in many forums on a lot of gear. I have been vilified for my choices, So be it. I don't get all defensive. I get it. I explain why I made a particular choice. If someone tells me (as you have) my gear is terrible I explain why I choose it. Period. I planted a seed. if they want to cultivate it or let it die, I m not offended either way.

Hell I sell the stuff and still don't offer "opinion" on WHAT"S BETTER. I let the customer decide. I get that all the time. "What guitar should I buy?" What sound system should we Buy" The answer is ALWAYS the same. "Let me set your choices up, explain the differences and some features and YOU DECIDE" I would never tell someone what to buy. I bought a Korg PA2x and sold it. I didn't gush about it, recommend people run out and get one. Same with the T3 and now the XS8. Whats good for me is not good for you. That goes ALL the way up the gear food Chain. Hmmmmm do I buy this $3000 Channel Strip or that one??? Well David Foster uses this one so it MUST be good....BS!

"If Don says they are good. they are good"

There are no "Dons" in my world and there shouldn't be in in anyones. Especially when discussing lower budget gear for live use. I have seen too many people (like me and the PA2x) lead people astray with their credibility then quietly abandon the ship they sailed in gloriously on. I don't do it and yes I will question those who do as do you, in most cases, rightfully so.



I certainly don't have or use elite recording gear. I track though a 1604 (that was used on a previous PA), into a Firebox and now the XS8 which I'm trying to figure out since ASIO will not allow two FW Ports.... I love the Mackie 824s, almost bought them, and they still may be my next monitor. I build my own PCs so they don't cost me anymore than $700 and keep them for at least 4 years. I buy the "sweetspot " components not the TOTL Speed components. I will buy proven quality reputable name brands though. All electronics have a high end low end and the sweet spot, where "bang for the buck" lives.
I bought the XS8 because it cost me less than an XS6, same with the Tyros, otherwise I would be looking at a PSR900 and used ES or Roland WS.




I agree. But my own experience has shown that "producers" and "engineers" at commercial studios will rarely offer positive opinion about anything created on lesser gear. They want you to use their gear. Period Many bash other commercial Studios output as well.

.To genuinely listen in wonderment and compliment (as opposed to patronize) someone's home studio output would be very hard for them to do and justify their expensive gear. I understand that. I gave up trying to please those types a long time ago and concentrated solely on the real target audience. Again I get it.



The bottom line is there are some things that are painfully obvious as you know when you dissed my Alesis Monitors..a few times... and I have to explain EXACTLY why I like them....a few times.LOL I did not take the attitude.."I am me" I am well respected (or should be) therefore they are great and I don't have to explain. LOL

The thing is I DON'T expect others to agree with my gear choices or give them a chance. I don't "sell" my choices, I know better. I REVEAL them. Big difference. I won;t tell a group of people my Monitor Ones are as good as HR824s. LOL Even You have spanked my use of the M1;s on more than one occasion.and I did not even Recommend them!!! LOL

I have never started a thread gushing about Monitors Ones or a Rode NT2 or Joe Meek VCQ1 or Tyros, in a Recording or even a Home Studio Forum. I just won't do it. Anymore then I would recommend everyone go out and buy a Motif XS8 or Tyros. I reveal my choices and IF questioned, I explain why. If another has the SAME needs I may save them some research. We have a pair of Klipsh Pro Media 2.1s on an office use refurbished Dell. I love those things, They would sound great on the T3 I'm sure. Would I consider using them on a gig? Of course not. We would get laughed out of the venue. Hell... The Bose system was a risk in that regard. LOL

There are certain things that affect one's common sensibilities. 8" drivers getting down to 30 HZ at any pace on any chart offends mine. I don;t need any more information .....Alesis Monitor Ones offended yours. Some things simply cannot be just accepted as fact. If its too good to be true ......it usually isn't and all that. And you .I and everyone else are perfectly within our right to question. Thats what forums are about. Not blind acceptance because one has a love affair with someone else's work.

We didn't buy a Yamaha acoustic because Nora Jones plays one....



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-24-2009).]

Fran,
Yes...I see where you are comming from.

If I was in the market for a new set of speakers (not true monitors) I might just get a pair and see. After all if they go all to heck in a few years...at that price trow them out and get something else.

Did you need a new pair of speakers or was this just a curiousity?

Lee S.

You are right. We don't take the arranger out. But we do play live and the expectations are high from both the clients and the performance is reflected soley through the PA we choose.

When someone claims they saw "the numbers on a $200 pair of PA speakers" and bought them based on the numbers (30HZ on 8" drivers?) then says you cannot depend on the "numbers" you have to "hear" them...Well who can blame the less connected and emotional to question that. From a purely technical standpoint if nothing else? I research based on the numbers. Credible professional gear is honestly speced out. Not so great gears uses Peak Power ratings and unreal freq response claims..... without the essential curves. I am suspect...sorry.

Arranger players are a different breed. I realize that. I have never actually SEEN one in performance so I probably don't understand the culture and choices.

However live performing is live performing. Live performing is live performing...... whether on a Roland Rd700 or Yamaha PSR413. IN that regard I do share some cultural similarities as a performer. I expect the best possible sound to reach the audience. I don't do it for my living anymore which is not to say I won't ever. I enjoy selling the gear now and going out when I get the bug. Some day I may have to do it again.

I understand not carrying a lot around. My wife is 43 5'2 100lbs and as of three years ago was carrying around a Mackie 802S, two JBL MR15s and the associated crap, and an RD700 by herself!! I get the down sizing thing. But she and I still wanted the best quality she could get and was easy to lug around. I decided she should give the Bose a try. She was stuck in her "Stereo paradigm" and the "dual box paradigm". But in the end The Bose System filled the bill on the PA side. A Casio Previa 320 on the 88 side for stair gigs and she even started playing guitar three years ago to take some guitar only gigs as well. to further lighten the load.

We use the Arranger in the SAME way everyone does...BACKING tracks. We just don't use it live. We can't repeat choruses.....LOL.

She would rather give that flexibility up in favor of two fisted keyboard playing on weighted keys with a band whether live or recorded. Thats all she has ever done and is comfortable with. I am indeed more inclined to take an arranger out if I were to do my own thing full time than she is. She won't think of it.

However I would still use the best PA gear possible and not accept less because I have to have a stereo field and therefore need something that offers that and is light at the same time.

Then again, most of my live performance BG was entirely in mono with monitor mixers and great reliable gear. I don't have this aversion to mono. I do appreciate professional, bullet proof, reliable and honestly spec'd and now light.... even if it cost a little more. Its part of our income. We try not to cut too many corners. The technology is out there that accommodate all of our requirements..... for now and keeps getting better.




[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-24-2009).]

Lee, like most of us I don't "need" anything..we just think we do..

I looked for something to use in my home studio..nothing high powered or large...something other than the Altec Lansing PC speaker system...

I was going to grab a pair of Edirol MA's but I knew they wouldn't make me content...I went shopping...looked at the Roland street cube and Mini Stereo Cube...They did sound good, but only 5 watts....durability was a concern...

I looked at the Mackie 150 , much more power but lacked the sound the Roland stereo cubes had...Likewise the TC-Helicon 300...I left undecided...Went on EBAY and the 802's caught my eye..I read reviews about OFD (only Factory Direct) and found a very favorable report...OFD, should not be confused with Podium Speaker Co...Podium makes a different selection of Hi Fi equipment, where OFD has a more select line..

To make a shorter story, I read the specs, and laughed a bit...after all I owned all the Name Brand models and none spec out the way they did....Price was so in expensive I just ordered..as one reviewer said..."if you aren't happy , you can double your money at a garage sale"..

When they arrived..the first thing I noticed, they were packed right..opened the carton..and they looked great...very finished looking...and they had substantial weight (18 pounds each)...I knew they were not going to be toys...

I set one up and played an MP3 thru it...wow great fullness..put the unit on the floor and pumped it up..WOW the bass was really there..no splatting like even the $3-400 stuff does....I quickly opened the other carton..(they ship individually)...set up stereo, one sitting on top of a Roland 100 Cube , and the other on the floor....I ran my G70 into the pair..I instantly loved the sound I heard..In the past I did not like my G70 thru my Roland 60 or the Traynor K4..they both had to be EQ'd ..right off the bat...The 802's were excellent just the way they were laid out...I had the mid EQ set in 12 noon[as in flat) and the volume at unity (Noon)...I then set them equally in height and spaced about 4 feet apart[in my studio room).. The tone an separation was great..I started my torture test..Using the master EQ and compression on my G70....the Master EQ and compression can rattle just about any speaker...Not only did they handle this,,they really sounded "dance" music capable...after a couple hours..I posted my results here...and the rest is history.....I also know the company has sold a lot of units because of this thread...

Cool.

So, my friend, could you answer me this:

Have you tried the single Bose system and then compared it to the sound of two Bose systems in stereo?

I have tried both setups, and the difference is quite startling....actually more like an "ear-opening" experience...really made the Tyros3, the S900 and and even an old Roland E-86 spring to life, and to my ears, the improvement was more than the sum of the parts.

That is why I said I would consider using two Bose systems in stereo, regardless of the fact it costs quite a bit, and it is a bit more fiddly to set up...it still is light as it comes apart.

Plus, you only need to buy one great PA system (plus it needs no monitors) as opposed to a new arranger every three or four years(or more often for some)

Try two Bose systems in stereo and tell me you don't hear a huge difference...just don't let your wife try it...or you'll be using that setup from now on.

I would not order the system Fran speaks of without actually trying them out myself...I rarely buy on word of mouth.

I did try the Logitech 5500 computer speakers...they are awesome, but in order to use "live" I feel one must do some modifications to the wiring setup, as it tends to be very cluttered...I think the mods are on PSR-Tutorial.

I use a pair of over 20 year old Yamaha MS60 powered monitors...over $700 Cdn each when I got them, and worth every penny as the exemplary reliability and the, new at the time, "Active Servo Technology" have made them perfect for my restaurant gigs...plus they are less than 30 lbs each.

If I buy a "big" system, it just may turn out to be a double Bose system....wouldn't need anything else for many years and it would easily pay for itself over time.

I just wouldn't buy a single one.

Ian

[B]
".....and the performance is reflected soley through the PA we choose. " ...


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-24-2009).][/QUOTE]

So when I get a compliment at one of MY gigs where I've used the Z-5500, it's because PA system made me sound good, right ... just asking ...

t.

I am just surprised that anyone can take such an entrenched position without even hearing the speakers. I mean that makes no sense......I mean a brand name is simply that...a brand name...Does the brand name tell you that what your ears are hearing is quality ??? Does the brand name tell you that after 5 years a product will still with stand on the road use (ask anyone that had a Korg triton extreme about how sturdy the casing is and thats a pro keyboard).

At least be willing to accept that the principal that you get what you pay for is simply a principal and not a rule....

Ian, was this a Model 1 experience? As in, were you A/B'ing a Single Model 1, then a Double Model 1?

This was using two Model II systems...we tried the single system, and then hooked two of them up.

The difference between using one, and then using two (in stereo) was amazing.

I was not very impressed with the arranger through a single Model II.

I will be probably be buying two L1 Model II systems in the early spring when I go back to personal gigging.

Sounds with stereo effects, either as main voices, or in the accompaniment parts were the most affected.

To me it is the best of both worlds...great coverage, AND stereo.

I would still use my two Yamaha MS60S for restaurant work, as I want the sound to stay within a certain area...the Bose would be used for everything else.

I think it would be a great investment.

Ian

Ian
I sold TWO Bose Mod I systems to the Big M Casino boat . My wife works on the boat and uses That system every week. The poles are 10' apart and in Stereo. Yes there is a noticeable difference and if you are sitting in the right area a BETTER sound But she is less than 5 feet between both of them. I am not claiming stereo is not good in small venues. I don;t think I would sacrifice PA quality and fidelity in order to achieve a stereo signal. In other words a great clear and even mono signal is better to me than a weak uneven low powered,limited freq range stereo system.

My wife would LOVE another tower. LOL And if I can get a deal from Bose like Yamaha delivers I may get her a Mod II tower. Yes they sound better wider and especially using stereo EFX which opens up the sound stage. She pans at 11-1 Just enough to keep the sound centered with some space. NO hard panning. Now the big question is is the difference worth $2000?

Thats the question I need the answer to to be comfortable buying a second pole. The portability remains the same four more Small pieces to carry. I think we should try a second Bass module first because stereo is less important to here then a big sound. She unrealistically believes a second tower will make her louder. I believe another SUB module will do the same thing. I tried two in the store and it makes all the difference in the world.

We sell the Ms-50DR system, for the DTexpress drums. I prefer them over what comes with the Tyros. but the Tyros speakers are custom mounted and do a fine job for home use and I imagine as live monitors at a venue. We did not buy them though. I plug into my trashy Monitor Ones and Subs LOL.

So the answer is yes they do sound better. $2000 better? Jury is out on that. and yes she uses them in in stereo at her gig out on the salt water in the sea air...So I know they will hold up. Our system only gets used for in town work in places without a house system (and sometimes in places with a crappy house system).
And yes she would love another tower and I may buy one for her. The stuff pays for itself. If I do, of course, I will let you know "how great two are in Stereo and how could I ever have thought otherwise" LOL



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-24-2009).]

Its a principle that cost me a lot of money to learn. I trust it now.

the SPECS tuned me off. 30 Hz response on what i thought was a 10" driver was bad enough but to find it listed for an 8" driver.....Thats all I needed to see. Sorry.
Specs SHOULD mean somthing. Peak Power means jack. I pass on anything advertised using PP watts too without hearing them.

In some areas Brand still means somthing. That said I LOVE my Vizio TV....But I would not have bought them if I had not seen them on another opinion. I did buy a Panasonic Plasma though based on opinion and reputation.

I have owned Mackie product and yes it is rock solid and trust worthy as are Bose and other premium branded goods,

Fran,
Sounds good. Looks like you found a reasonable cost (that's an understatement!) set of speakers that you like..Nuf said. That's what matters.

It's all about the sound to me and each of us may prefer something different.

Without a proven long term track record, I probably would not take them to gig without backup....But tht's only MHO.

Let's don't praise these too much here (they might raise the price) :-)

Lee

Hard to sidestep an issue you can't even SEE, I guess...

Look, I wouldn't put anything down unheard (features are another thing, but SOUND is sound. I loved the Audya's demos, and said so immediately). It's not like I haven't heard a pair of Monitor One's before... Got some friends with them. Thing is, for mastering purposes, it's MUCH harder to get a consistent response with a sub. I prefer a speaker that doesn't need a sub to sound full range. That's those 824's forte. I can't count the number of times people ask me 'where's the sub?' And I'm running them flat, no boost. Straight out the MOTU, into the 824's. I highly recommend them as your next monitor.

I don't care what specs say. Most of them, even some of the best (you ever look at what the ohmage is for Mackie SRM and power amp specs? ) are close to fiction. It's just gobbledygook for people without ears. I don't buy anything without listening and trying out. It really doesn't matter what the specs say. But if Fran can get these things to sound decent with the Master EQ and Comp on on a G70, that's not bad...

I'm not going to order a pair, but if I see them in a store, I'm for sure going to at least check them out.

The 824 MkIIs are on my shortlist. I am spoiled with a Sub though. I like listening to my reference CDS with a Sub. I have two Subs with Bose 701s in my living room. I have one in the car (stock). I am not sure I could enjoy playing without a Sub. But I probably will put the Sub on a Sub mix on the 1604 so I can mix using just the Mackies and bring the sub in for tracking and general listening and patch the Mackies directly to the Firebox. .

Specs do matter to me. I bought the Alesis based on price and trade reviews at the time. I would not buy the Alesis Powered MkIIs. Yeah I'm a Mackie fan but the fact that Greg is no longer involved and they moved their assembly offshore gives me pause.
The 824s are VALUE speakers nowadays when compared to Adams and even the Event fare.
Back in the day they were expensive...

BTW whats wrong with SRM350 Specs...They look fine. Nothing jumps out as unrealistic. Input impedance? for a line level seems ok.
The 824s are said to reach 35Hz on the low side. Is that your experience? Where do they drop off. 35 seems pretty low for an 8" driver even in a Bi Amped reference Mackie monitor. Does a certain port placement affect that. Or will they deliver 35Hz suspended on a rope in the middle of a room LOL

I couldn't help myself. I ordered a pair. Don't need 'em, but I might leave them in the van for backup, if they are as good as Fran says, and I have no reason to believe they won't be.
Rest assured, I will review them for you, good or bad.
Ian, you're going to make me hook up both of my L1s just to hear what they sound like together aren't you? If I ever have them both at home at the same time, I might try it.
DonM

I may order a pair of the speakers Fran spoke of when I get to hear them...they'd be a great back-up, as well as a nice little bump up from my Yamaha MS60S.

What always put me off from buying the Bose L1 was the stereo issue...I know it doesn't matter to some, but stereo does have me spoiled, especially when it comes to hearing effects on my sounds...guitar delays, and rotary speaker, as well as the ubiquitous Electric Piano stereo pan.

I think you'll fall in love with the difference when using two Bose in stereo...the other cool thing, is that you can use the panning to more extreme settings and not end up losing the sweet spot.

Using two Bose is not that much more difficult than using a pair of cabinets and the subsequent monitors...and they will still take up far less stage space than the latter setup...only stickler would be the price for some, but consider that many pay far more for their arranger keyboard alone, and most wouldn't keep it as long as they would a PA system.

When it sounds right to me, it always makes me play better and enjoy the gig so much more...I remember when I first started using the two Yamaha MS60S after years of just using a single keyboard amplifier speaker combo.

You like emulating guitar; me too, and although you do a much better job of it than I, I love the effect that stereo has on the DSP, especially for pedal steel, and Strat/Tele type sounds.

I'll be looking forward to your comments, both on the stereo Bose, and the speakers that Fran discovered.

Ian

If Fran says they sound great ....
believe me they are GREAT!

Depends on where the gig is, Who the patrons are and how large the room is. IF its in the TV room in a nursing home or Carlos and Charlies. Same gear two different impressions.

No doubt they are "GREAT" to Fran...but we all have our own definition of "great" (he thinks the G70 is great, remember ), and unless I hear them and play my Yamaha PSR-S900 through them, I will not spend the money on them.

It's like when Fran said the Traynor K4 was a great keyboard amp...true, it is; but it's a not a great arranger amp, in my opinion...I played a Yamaha PSR-S900 and a Roland E60 through one in the store some time ago, and it was mediocre at best.

Now, for a keyboard amp, which no doubt the word "keyboard" meaning electric/electronic pianos, synthesizers, and especially clone-wheel organs, the K4 works extremely well, because it doesn't have to deal with the myriad of sounds and frequencies that an arranger keyboard puts out...in fact, no dedicated keyboard amp I've ever used has done a great job on an arranger.

Traynor K4...great for a band keyboardist...not so great for arranger player.

I might really like these new speakers that Fran recommends, but I always try before I buy.

I am going to get a pair of Bose L1 Model II this spring/summer...I spent considerable time with them, and although the single Bose comes highly recommended from many people on this forum, I found it did not do the job I wanted, unless two units were used...it really makes a difference, and brings it to a new level.

The PSR-S900 sounded awesome through them (and well it should, considering their price ), but I feel it's worth the investment as Bose make a durable and reliable product.

I don't mind the extra setup time...I always plan my gigs to allow for it...I don't rush anything any more...life is hectic enough without having my music becoming that way....that's when I relax.

Ian



[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 02-25-2009).]

I don;t know where people think the Bose are expensive. Quite the contrary for a high end PA.

Add up the cost of Yamaha or JBL TOTL "Club" speakers, Poles, a Sub, Mixer, a pair of power Amps.(or High end Powered Mixer) monitoring system, cables, Hand Truck even the vehicle needed to get that stuff around. No take the depreciation and resale effort and value.

Now take a standard Bose System and do the same. IF one looks at the demand for USed systems on Ebay one will see people the cost of owning the Bose for even two years is at most $700!! Resale is high and used systems are in demand and relatively rare. IF one has Two systems they may depreciate $1100. Still less than the conventional high line system...

I show customers the numbers the Ebay sales and anyone who has tried to sell a conventional system knows the resale is not only hard but the losses are deep.Thanks to Bose pricing policy the value stays high.

So the Bose actually cost LESS to own and operate on many levels.

All I know I'm glad I sold mine when the going was good

Yep, when you put it that way, it sure does...but many people don't look at gear as an investment...I do.

It also makes even more sense when you consider the Bose will last a long time, as well as not taking up much space compared to a conventional PA with monitors.

My Yamaha MS60S speakers are over 20 years old...they were pricey when new...but, I've needed nothing else since I bought them and they have paid for themselves many times over...plus they sound great for restaurant work.

For a long throw PA the Bose in stereo will easily do the bigger jobs, and I'm sure it will give me as much value over long term as the Yamaha MS60S have done.

I always say, "you ultimately play the speaker", so it had better be good.

Ian

Talk about a return on a investment.....After 25 years of use, my Roland Cubes are still worth what I paid (dealer cost at the time.. )...and remember one true statement...."you don't lose a dime until you sell them"

The trouble with the Bose depreciation..most people start out paying the "list" price...Go back in 2 months and see how much a dealer wants to give you for the Bose..

Also $1,100 as stated foe depreciation of a pair of Bose..is too much for me to consider in a loss for 2-3 years use....My aim is always to break even when I sell off equipment after it has done it's job..

The Bose does all the things that most people mentioned..you can hear equally through out the room..clear vocal range, light package.etc...On the exaggerated side are the numbers again like all the companies are playing....and as loud as you scream it can....They can not handle the "dance" crowd..where the "conventional systems do...

Not a put down, but a realistic observation...

A Dealer wont give $1500 for a $5000 Taylor/

25% of retail MSRP is the norm for trade ins. Anyone trading in MI gear at a Music Store is not very smart, especially something in demand with a active used market. High end gear is usually a bargain and in demand.

If one is talking RAP and Sub frequency dance music, nothing less than an 18" SUb will do the best job. A Bose System can easily suffice for pop top 40. ballroom or whatever dancing...Especially adding another $300 Sub.

lets not forget all the Thousands you made giging with the gear............so you never really LOSE anything on you initial investment

"If one is talking RAP and Sub frequency dance music, nothing less than an 18" SUb will do the best job. A Bose System can easily suffice for pop top 40. ballroom or whatever dancing...Especially adding another $300 Sub. "


I have to disagree with you here....

We play 50's thru 70's music..the 60 's and 70's include a lot of "dance music"..that is not rap..

We play outside boardwalk jobs to virtually thousands of people...There is simply no way the Bose system with two or many more subs will compete with the Yorkville system we use...conventional systems like the Yorkvilles are made to feel the thump in your chest...that gets the dancers going...and the shear volume power is there...it also carries several blocks away...

In a controlled environment, yes the Bose perform great, but don't tell me they will ..as Gary says.."blow out the windows"..

BTW: the above scenario has been compared at the boardwalk gig...all the people involved with the project and the local spectators..all confirm..the two sound systems are far apart in the "big" sound department..Even the "Bose" band reluctantly say so...

It is sorta like me saying the 802's can bang with the Yorkvilles in an outdoor venue..


BTW: the cost of the Yorkville system was less than a Bose with 2 subs...

We should really compare apples with oranges when it counts...not necessarily comparing name brands to unknown brands...

I can attest to the Yorkvile system Fran's group uses.....simply AWESOME on stage!!
http://www.yorkville.com/default.asp

No doubt it sounds great, Donny, but would you, as a solo performer, haul around that much PA system?

PA's are easy to rent if a special system is needed...so you generally go with the system that meets 99% of your needs, and do a rental for the odd gig...and you can it write it off.

My style is way more laid back these past many years...I just want a high quality sound, and an easy to transport system...I'll leave the chest thumping head banging stuff to those more qualified, and for those who like playing it...I don't...I like the standards, the old country stuff, Jimmy Webb and Bacharach are also high on my list.

That kind of music just sounds so deluxe through the double Bose.

I'm almost surprised you aren't using a such a system...your music is 1st class and very orchestral/big band...it would be awesome.

Ian

Not to change the subject and get back on the original subject, however, Fran keep us updated on your recent purchase, and has anyone bought the 10" models of these units? How do they sound??

I had an interesting experience Friday night.
As some of you know, I used to have my own club, in a motel, for some seven years.
A month or so ago, the new owners of the motel called to ask if I could do a special Mardi Gras night for them. Since I was off that night, I agreed.
What I didn't realize is that in the past few months, the club has gone totally Karaoke six nights a week.
I went down the day before to be sure they knew that I don't do Karaoke. They did. A large group of customers from out of town had asked for me.
Anyway, I was to play from 8:00 til midnight.
I arrived about 6:45 to set up, but the Karaoke guy was going. The place was jam-packed with people and I could hear the music before I got out of the car. Huge speakers, with sound level so high your ears would bleed. This place seats 56 people max.
I went to the office and the manager said that at 5:00 the place was full so he asked the K guy to work for awhile. He said he would be out of the way by 8:00.
I told him I needed a minimum of 30 minutes to set up, so he said no problem, start when you get ready.
It took me about 10 minutes to set up and try to follow the K guy's act. He did have them rockin'.
Well I pumped up the bass a little and set the L1 at close to "noon". Hadn't played that loud indoors ever. I kicked off with Jambalaya, to a rock beat and the place erupted. Haven't heard cheers that loud in a while. I went right into Old Time Rock n Roll, then Honky-Tonk Woman (Stones).
After that I said "I hope ya'll like Country because that's what you're gonna get for a while". Again the loud cheers.
Most of the crowd was from Texas, so I did T for Texas, Texas when I die, Ft. Worth, All My Exes--the usual assortment of Texas songs, again at really loud levels.
It was fun to play loud for a change, but by the end of the night I was totally exhausted from expending all that energy. When the crowd is into it, it's really contagious.
People kept coming up and saying stuff like "That's our kind of music". The younger people even got into it. You would think Brown-eyed Girl would be so trite, but no, it never fails.
Anyway, the Bose did everything the big K setup did, but with more clarity and better coverage in the back of the room. On the dance floor you could get into the bass, but the mids and highs weren't painful as they were before I got there.
I have played everything from living rooms to outdoors for 300 people with the L1, and it never fails to do the job, and get plenty of compliments. The K guy stayed around for about an hour and when I took a break, he wanted to know all about the Bose.
I'm really glad more acts around here don't have one. My demand (and price) has gone up since I was "converted".
Amazingly enough, DNJ and Gary D. convinced me to give it a try. Donny praised it so highly I had to get one. Thanks, my friend, even though you have changed your tune!
DonM

Donny..change his tune!!!!!!!! Never..

Don, I too hate the harshness of being too loud...when we do the "loud" jobs, I am glad I am behind the speakers...even than with Stu and JoAnn's monitors..it is still too loud for me...

It is such a pleasure doing my Elvis, Dean, Frank stuff when I solo gig..

[This message has been edited by Fran Carango (edited 02-25-2009).]

Don.....as you already know I always give my honest opinions the Bose Pas was no different as I was one of the first to buy one when they came to market.....the sound was never a problem for me Mono or Stereo it certainly does the job with one sub or two if needed & if I stayed in one room all the time I would probably use the Bose PAS...if you need stereo buy two complete Bose Units.....why I sold it was that it doesn't give me the flexibility I desire when working a hectic different venue gig schedule every day as I do. The Bose PAS has to be set up the same way always which wasn't doable for my gigs...I much rather have two powered speaker setups a large 15" & small setup...this way I can mix & match to suit the need with 1,2,3,4 speakers if needed............I never begrudge anyone who enjoys the Bose....after all it's only a speaker....what goes thru them is the real winner....



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 02-25-2009).]

Kingfrog ... Going back to my earlier posts I was talking about using the Z-5500 at my COUNTRY CLUB gigs ...

t.

Tony, are you still trying to get on the same page ..with Kingfrog?

Fran, I got sidetracked. My 802's are on the way (special deal from Randall). They'd better be good or I'll be right back critiquing your future performances . BTW, I noticed on MSNBC that Miss North Wildwood (2007) was just arrested for passing counterfeit $50.00 bills. She looks like one of your groupies (isn't that your territory?).

Seriously, I intend to run them in stereo from the line-outs on the K4 (more coverage, I hope, without compromising the good sound of the K4). If your review on these is as accurate as it was on the K4, this setup should sound ok. I'll let you know.

chas

Worse things have happened

Yes she is from my territory....I kept sending her into that Wawa for my tea for the ride home, and she keeps coming out with my tea and a handful of cash..

Hurry up and test the 802's, I need someone to step up and confirm my findings...or shoot me down..

It looks like you guys all got better deals than I got...and I bought 2 pair, and tried to whip up sales here on SZ....Sasha if you are reading...you owe me dinner, and breakfast if it works out well..

Well, at least we now know how Fran is paying for all that gear .

chas

If Fran says the're great ....
believe me they are GREAT!

Fran, would you really buy a Bose system only to use it for 2 years?
(Did I read you right?)

If Donny says that if Fran says they're GREAT does that meant that indirectly, Donny says that they're GREAT?

The thick plottens.

Ian

Ian........Fran is my best buddy & I always take his opinion seriously........this Friday I'll know more on the 802's when I get them here & take them out on stage for this weekends gigs....stay tuned....I can give my own critique

Thanks Donny...I value your opinion highly although I still wouldn't order or buy a pair till I try my Yamaha PSR-S900 through them...I'm in no hurry...if I miss out on them, it's no big deal.

I'm more interested in getting the two Bose L1 Model II....should have them before the summer, or even sooner.

Ian

No, I was referring to Kingfrog's comment, where we were talking about depreciation..and a probable depreciation of $1,100 for a pair of Bose..(his numbers)..


My first turn off, was and still remains...paying list price for any item ..and I always thought Bose to be over priced (the whole line)..

If I was to spend 4 thousand on a pair of Bose...It would be a decision based on the fact they would be keepers....Although I did like what I heard with the Bose, they were not for my needs..I don't wear hats and do not need a hat rack..

Oh ok, well fair enough then, and well put.

(I think I'll steal that last line... )

Mind you, I DO wear hats... Maybe I haven't given the Bose a fair enough shake? Never thought of that application...

Hey, for people with a stereo PAS system, how about stringing a light pole between stacks? Combination PA and light truss...

Or, if it rains, throw a tarp over them, you got a tent (or a teepee if just one pole)...... Hmmm. All kinds of possibilities. I think I have seriously underestimated the PAS

How about a Strippers dancing pole

So you wear hats...that must look unique...most people wear them one at a time...

Depends on what they are covering...

Stripper pole. Hadn't thought of that one. Must be getting old...

First you tell us you play naked...and now you want to add a new dimension to your act.

A bold move, Donny, you are such an innovator.

And as long as they aren't chicken hats...

These speakers gotta be good....hey we're up to 144 posts so far

If post numbers meant anything, the MS WOULD be the world's best arranger! And the Bose PAS the best PA...

You know, we haven't had much of a T3 dust-up for a while. I guess this means that it really IS a good arranger I think an inverse number of posts indicates the better equipment...

Guess that makes my G70 top dog

(That's dog in a good way, Ian )

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 02-25-2009).]

Yes, the G70 is an amazing instrument Diki...I could listen to it for minutes...

Seriously, your G70 would sound some good through the double Bose system...we ran an old second hand E-86 through them, and it sounded terrific...in my opinion, that's the way all arrangers should be amplified...lots of coverage, and excellent stereo imaging.

Have you tried your G70 with this type of setup?

I wasn't much of a Bose supporter until I tried the two systems (stereo).

I think it is, or more rightly, "they" are worth the investment, especially since it will be long term.

Plus, you don't need stands or monitors, so the stage is uncluttered,


Ian




[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 02-25-2009).]

I've said before many times, Ian... the typical type of gig I do involves being loud and upfront where the dancers and these actually there for the music are, and being a LOT quieter for those that wish to converse (or just order a drink!) or eat in relative peace further back. The Bose actually works AGAINST you in those scenarios, just as a regular PA works against those that want full room even coverage.

Strokes for folks.

What? Powdered speakers?

[img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img]

Yeah, they're great with a fresh cup of coffee.

chas

...Made with dehydrated water...

I understand your point very well, Diki, as I need the same type of speakers for my restaurant gigs...that's why I use the Yamaha MS60S for those scenarios.

My plans, starting with the upcoming tourist season that starts in June, will be to do a series of indoor concerts at a local theatre (restored from the 30's)...so I will want the PA to fill the room and give all patrons the same basic listening experience throughout.

I will be using a vocalist for some of the gigs, and also a guitarist buddy of mine for a bunch as well...it will fun.

The plans got held up a bit by my recent surgery, but they are now back on track again.

I have no plans of retiring my Yamaha MS60S and/or my restaurant gigs, but I do want to expand my capabilities and versatility.

I can get the Bose at a great price (it pays to have friends in the business) so it won't be a big layout of money, especially compared to the return I will get from it, plus it is a reliable piece from what I have learned in my investigations.

If the focus of your gigs ever changes, it comes highly recommended.

Ian

First, hello! I registered because of this topic. Unfortunately I don't have any insight to share, rather I'm looking for some

I need a monitor/amp for a casual rock/pop band situation (ie, not gigging often, mostly for fun). Money is very tight right now, or else I'd be looking at a Mackie 350/450 or a 100watt+ keys amp...I need something that can serve as practice monitor with a loud drummer (is there any other kind? ) and as stage monitor where there isn't a dedicated mix, so I was kind of thinking something with a 12 or 15" speaker. However, if these can get over a nearby drummer and rock guitarist, the price is certainly right. I would be going mono for now unfortunately.

Looking forward to more feedback on these. Any comments on whether they would work for my situation would be greatly appreciated, as would other options.

Thanks!

I would look at the Alto PSLA4 if you want a fairly full range sound.
Behringer has some powered speakers although I tell my customers not to buy any "budget" amplified product that is mission critical. For a monitor the Behringer is a decent bang for the buck solution as are the Altos.
box.....

http://www.directproaudio.com/product.cfm?directid=55880

Don't know about the speaker yet, they will be here Monday. But I am very impressed with the quick service. I ordered them mid-afternoon, and they shipped the same day.
I bid $220. and got 'em, btw.
DonM

Hey, thanks for that...I hadn't heard of those before.

One reason those 8" cheap speakers appeal to me is that they might be able to tide me through this period of time until I can save up for something nice. In other words, if I go budget, go *really* budget I won't be using the amp/speaker like a travelling full-time musician might, though, so something like the Behringers might hold up fine.

I had two of the new Behringer powered speakers. They worked great.
I got them from George Kaye, I think.
DonM

I should have them here tomorrow.....

Well, I second the quick service at least...I emailed a question about the return policy and had an answer in five minutes. This was the only factory direct site, not the ebay store.

Apparently they have 10" ones also, though those don't appear on the site.

Looking forward to more reviews

Edit: Seeing as how shipping is free over 199, maybe I'm looking at stereo after all



[This message has been edited by Stokely (edited 02-26-2009).]

The 8" 802's are great..Take my word , they will do what you are interested in...and they are better than Kingfrog's suggestions...

They are loud , full , great bass and lots of headroom...

Folks here are going to read a lot of positive feedback in a few more days....I hope OFD still has them in stock for the rest of you folks..

$220..those rip offs..charging me $240, and I gave all the publicity..

Well, if I'm able to get 8" speakers (these or others) with my pathetic budget, and they can do the trick as monitors, that opens up the possibility that I can sell my passive studio monitors and come out somewhere close to break even

I'd prefer to have two vs one speaker for versatility, but I definitely don't need two large speakers (and can't afford it)...

Edit: tipe-o


[This message has been edited by Stokely (edited 02-26-2009).]

Fran I am looking into who has these in Australia, as they might also be good for me to buy for very small restaurants I do.

BUT the problem I had before, and I suspect with these, is the speaker stands have WAY too big a "footprint" and I could'nt find speaker stands with the same size fitting connector with smaller leg space, if you know what I mean.

Are there any smaller speaker stands available in the US?

Thanks
Dennis

Dennis , I will check it out and see what is available..stands with a smaller floor span..It is possible to use an adapter on tripod mic stands, but they are not as stable...I will get back to you...

http://www.avstoreonline.com/vti/home/vti_home_skst_surr.html

With these smaller speakers you can just keey the tripod legs closed more for a smaller footprint also.

With the small Barbettas, I used to use guitar amp stands. Worked great, and fold up to very small space.
DonM

I use a pair of these for my Yamaha MS60S, which are nearly the same dimesions as the referred to speakers.

Perfect.

Now to find some out here.. As well as the speakers that is.

I will ahve to look here because at that price the shipping from USA will be the same amount as the speakers themselves

Thanks Fran.

Dennis

Thanks Ian.

Now those I HAVE seen out here. And I might have to look at them instead if I cannot find the style Fran found. What height do they go up to Ian? I usually stand when playing, so it look kinda funny if they were at my kneecaps LOL...

Dennis

Hi Dennis,

I mostly use these stands at home, and have them on either side facing me and I always sit when I play, so they are just about waist level at their lowest settings, and they will raise up about a foot or so.

What I use at some gigs is a pair of cheap keyboard stands...X-type...when they are open to the first notch or so, the MS60S will just rest nicely on the bars...they are a little higher and about ear level when I am sitting.

The footprint is a little less than the speaker width...they are pretty sturdy, and I just rest the speaker on top with no velcro or any other type of reinforcement.

I always place the stands on either side and behind me, as I don't use a microphone.

Standing whilst playing might make them a little too low to hear properly.

Ian

In researching Podium aand Mackie 350's I see the mackies are bi-amped (two amps for each speaker)with crossovers high frequency amp and low frequency amp. If I understand correctly this is a big advantage over the Podium speakers with only 1 amplifier per speaker/ Low frequency waves tend to rob mid and high frequency waves when sharing the same amplifier. the cost diffrence being Mackie's have two amplifiers per speaker and the podiums have one.

Well, I must say as a web developer the Podium Pro website is pretty much a trainwreck...of course maybe they are all busy making speakers

The ebay feedback profile is very encouraging. Of course, I don't see much in the way of comparison to better-known brands (such as we've seen in this thread and hopefully more on the way).

As long as these sound *ok* and can get me heard in practice, I'm really leaning toward becoming another guinea pig. I can get four of those 802s for the price of one Mackie 350....

Edit: is there any way to see just what the 7 people (out of 10,000) didn't like? I don't see any way to see just negative feedback. (not an ebay person).

[This message has been edited by Stokely (edited 02-27-2009).]

Oh man.... first small speakers, now small speaker stands... what next?.. 31 key keyboards?!?!?! ... when will this craziness END?!?!?! ...
t.

Yeah,what did that smooth-talking DonM say to get that extra $20.00 off? Hey, that's a decent bottle of wine (ten bottles of the kind Ian and Diki drink ). Mine should be here Wed. These guys seem to run a very professional operation (factoryDirectBuy). Shipped the same day as ordered. Can't beat that. Now, let's hope the product pans out. Talked to Russ the other day, he's getting a pair; you've stirred up quite the little mini-tempest. Be prepared to be either the hero or the goat .

chas


[This message has been edited by cgiles (edited 02-27-2009).]

There's a rumor going around that KingFrog has secretely ordered a pair.



chas

If Fran says the're great ....
believe me they are GREAT!

The difference in price seems to be ebay vs the onlyfactorydirect site. Unfortunately the 10" version is only on ebay right now.

I found a way (via a different site) to see negative comments for a seller in ebay. Only one for 90 days and one neutral. OFD commented with a phone number saying they'd fix things; I might shoot an email to the buyer to see if they did.

mine should be here today..........use YOUR ears not some silly internet reviews.

No offense but there is no possible positive comparison to be made between the SRM350s and some $100 Ebay fare. I will tell you if you play BAss heavy music the Mackies don;t get down the the E- String on a Bass guitar. A sub may be a good idea with them.

But you are right single Amplifiers are robbing power to for bass notes that can cause a sucking sound. No pun intended.

IF you are a pro,use pro gear. Your clients and audience deserve no less and will hear the difference if the next guy is using pro gear.

If you are a successful pro, you certainly can or should be able afford to, you really cannot afford not to. Bi-Amped is always the way to go with powered Speakers pointed in the Audience direction, and a hell of a lot more efficient.

NO matter what you read, There is no such thing as low budget quality, People confuse "bang for the buck" with quality. "Bang for the buck" delivers an illusion of quality.Nothing is free. Doesn't work that way other wise they would be playing PSR 413s
rather than multi thousand dollar Arrangers. Toyotas and Hondas cost more than Fords and Chevys for a reason,The public is willing to pay the premium for a reason.


BY not putting the sound through the best possible gear to the audience ears and/or cutting corners in that regard is amateurish no matter how well on plays or how many old ladies claim they love the music. IT also raises the bar for the competition while showing the clients you put you money into your craft.

[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-27-2009).]

Oh really Ive heard so many so called players use quality gear and sound like shit...its the talent in you......again let me hear what you got ...my ears are my judge always !

I'm warmin' up the Photoshop.




-mike

If Fran says the're great ....
believe me they are GREAT!

Can't wait Mike. You are the Photo Master.
Eddie

I have nothing to prove to you.+LOL..You don't pay my way. I have seen what "judgments" are made regarding the gear here gear here. Why would I take judgments made regarding content or talent seriously?

Your opinion means squat. I can assure you I earned my keep for the past 15 years of 20 years covering popular songs and selling my own on a level few will experience and have done well enough to be given a choice to use the best possible gear. My mike choice is least a wireless SM87 nothing less. I will bring my own if I have to.

I don't need to pass your judgment. I passed my tests years ago. The gig requests I get now require travel and multi days away, and pay a min of a grand. I turn down far more gigs then I take nowadays.I am over planes and condos. I do what want and right now thats working with the wife on special occasions for her clients who want what I do.

I am not going to set myself up here for your skewed judgment. You want to come to the Beach when we are playing you are welcome. I posted some of my work, like it or not. I am not afraid, I have already been judged by "critics" with a far larger audience than this, and when you add it up, millions who have seen me perform over 20 years in major venues.

You like everyone else can take or leave my opinion. At the end of the day its not even advice. Only opinion. And even around here I can see who knows their stuff and who clearly is a weekend warrior.

AS much as we else gets into it wth Diki.I respect him because He KNOWS his shyte as may a few others, Be careful who your your mentors are. Ego stroking by your buddies can be deadly in performance when faced with a real paying audience. I learned that a long time ago as well. Trust no one but yourself.

BTW Quality gear will not make a bad performance good. But make no mistake inferior gear can diminish a great performance. That goes for the stage as well as in the Studio


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-28-2009).]

LOL I love those statements.....
You yourself said you judge just said you with your ears...Seems to me you are judging with your heart and emotions.

$2000 Genelec Speakers sound great for Mixing...would I take them on a gig? Uh no...

My Pro Media Klipsch 2.1 Computer speakers sound great...again they have their purpose. Live performance isn't one of them.

Sometimes you just "know." I have never heard $200 Casio but I know it would make a poor showing at a paying gig as would a Fender Starcaster, or unheard Yamaha PSR213.


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-27-2009).]

Hardly, but I suspect you will love them..

If I do they will be for the Garage,The Minimus 7s are drying out...


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-27-2009).]

I sure hope someone chimes in soon ...so Mike can put my face somewhere..

Didn't anyone get the speakers yet...I received my second pair today....

I'm leaning toward order next week. I'm debating 8" vs 10"...from what you've described two 8s should be plenty for practice and monitors.

I resurrected this old thread on another forum: http://www.karaoke-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=15074&start=50

Only other place on the internet where people are talking about these that I can find

Edit: the reason I did so was that OFD was going to send one of the members there a pair of speakers to demo. Then the thread died off.

[This message has been edited by Stokely (edited 02-27-2009).]

I can't stop laughing when I think about where I could take that statement.



I love ya, man!


-mike

Perhaps Kingfrog could point us to speakers he DOES recommend in the same price range as these things...?

Just so we can tell HIM that we don't really need to listen to them at all to know his recommendation has no value!

Sauce for the goose...

I guess I am STILL waiting for King to let us know how he deals with a customer at his store that slams HIS equipment recommendations at the store without so much as a listen? 'No, how could an arranger be any good? NO....! Don't play me it... I already KNOW that they couldn't POSSIBLY be any good!"

The 802’s arrived this after noon here………when I picked up the boxes I could feel the nice weight these lil babies had…..after opening the boxes I was very excited to see what all the fuss was about….as I unwrapped them and took them out I was really impressed with the quality build of these speakers…nice thick rubber feet the knobs were tight, nuetric inputs are a blessing also and nothing about them were cheaply made….but still in my head I had that “how good can they be for $220.00 for Two”?………
Well I proceeded to set them up with my S900 to finally give them a good work out…both speakers on the floor 6 feet too each side of me…..I was going to try a few different types of songs to see how they would be and then push some vocals through them also at peak volumes….I set the speakers at 5 Master Vol & flat 0 midrange…I started with a nice Latin number with some strong bass and I couldn’t believe the sound I was getting…crystal clear and punchy more like what I’m used too with much more expensive powered speakers of this size, so far so good……..let me add that these units are SUPER Quiet also.
Next I tried some unplugged acoustic songs to hear the clearness of the speakers low & highs…using Classic guitars, SA sounds & Trumpets etc, …using a Bolero style I was amazed at the nuance of the sounds & stereo separation with the guitars……..Now I’m saying to myself these could really do my small & sm/med gigs with NO problems at all.
Next I pushed them strong with some Disco & Rock & Roll songs & Vocals with my fingers crossed I wasn’t disappointed at all no distortion all clear vocals and this is at stage volume setting on my KB hope my neighbors don’t get mad hahahahahah Not only were the highs so clear but the bass response is amazing for an 8” speaker at this price range nice robust and tight…..Now I’m convinced I certainly made the RIGHT choice & with confidence I will take them on stage for my next two med gigs 100pp each this weekend for sure….. I can only imagine what the 10” & 15” ones would sound like….at this point I would of been happy paying twice the price for these super speakers.
Fran has done it again my friends… these PODIUM pro 802’s get the TWO thumbs up from me for sure…don’t hesitate to order them. I might just get another pair also.Now I'm off to Walmart to buy the Protege` luggage rolling case for these two units.

I'll report back after the gigs………………

dp



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 02-27-2009).]

8" speakers CAN sound better than 12" speakers...depends on lots of things. Porting, driver quality, Poli or fiber material used. magnet size/quality. and of course the cabinet design in general (solid or ratling) Bi-Amp is best, but not everything.

Bose is expert at making a small physical speaker system sound superb ..but you won't get them for no $200.

Back when I bought Hi-Fi speakers I remember buying DB+ (out of Canada), to me unknown brand...1/3 the price of the Yamaha's, Jenson's etc. I went to a club that had several of them mouted in the ceiling...and a Klipsh folded horn 15" in the wall...My God that system rocked the hell out of you..and very nice & clear. This was during the disco years...and taht music put a load on a system.

The next day I went to the store that did the sound system for them..and bought a pair.

So, I paid 1/3 and had a great system...so...maybe these $240 /pair speakers are way underpriced and very good quality?

I hope they have enough power in the amp..because...if not when you turn them up it ain't gonna be pretty. Most distortion is caused by too low of power amp for the job...(Clpping occurs).

I would like to hear a pair of these some time.

Lee S.

My biggest concern would be that they are short throw and won't push the sound far enough...lows are usually never a problem, but mids and highs can be a issue.

Setting them up in a larger space and playing a SMF through them whilst you walk around in front of them should give you a good idea how far they'll push.

I'm still going to try before I buy.

Ian

Lee the 802's have power to spare..I think the design of the case and engineered porting along with a higher quality than we think in the 8 inch speaker and HF driver...make a complete efficient package...Just order them..

[This message has been edited by Fran Carango (edited 02-27-2009).]

Ian, where are you going to try them...The company sells direct to the consumer...not dealers..

And I am telling you they cover a room...period.. ....a BIG room..

Well, perhaps they do the job for you Fran, and I'm sure you are pleased with their performance, but I will not buy anything in regards to a speaker system or a keyboard unless I can try it in a similar situation to where it will be used.

I don't NEED these speakers, so it's no big deal if I don't get them...I already have a great system for my restaurant gigs.

I just thought they would be good for a backup or a nice little system for my girlfriend's digital piano.

No try...no buy...no exceptions.

Ian

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Fran Carango:
[B]Lee the 802's have power to spare..I think the design of the case and engineered porting along with a higher quality than we think in the 8 inch speaker and HF driver...make a complete efficient package...Just order them..

There ya go Lee. Go ahead and order them and bring them to my next gig so I can try them out. (I am really tempted now, but, alimony ya know!) Gary

Fran, Donny, whoever tries these speakers this weekend, try them on polls too, not only on the floor. Would be interested if you get a good bass response.

Peter

Great news Donnny. I should be getting mine next week and will also put to test the same day. I'll be sure to check out the long throw - good point

I plan to point up from the floor - no more mounting things for me - too dangerous.

That's great Zuki.....I hope to hear more reviews on these speakers...I'll know more when I gig them this weekend.I'm glad I have two smaller jobs to test them....all else i use the big gun 15" speakers.

Good Donny. Can't wait for your review I sure would like to downsize speakers. I do love the 450s - tough act to follow.

Perhaps you didn't READ an earlier post. I don't RECOMMEND gear.Pros know what they want. Beginners need to try different product. I get asked but I don't recommend Guitars, PA systems, Keyboards, Mikes, Interfaces...I go out of my way NOT to "recommend" I do DEMO what I think the customer wants i their price range, and let them Make the choice. I'll spend as much time with them as they need. I hold my opinion and relay facts about the product I tell them they need to make the choice for themselves.

I have been around long enough to know everyone has different ears, tastes, styles, gigs, and requirements. They set their own bar.
I can tell a lot about a customer by what they trash. Actually helps me to direct them to something they might like.
If they trash Beringer. I understand where they are professionally and won't be showing them Yamaha BRs, or Crate, but I will demo the Club series and roll out the TOTL Yorkvilles, and the Bose PAS.

I refuse to "sell" them on gear they know better without hearing it. I know they don;t HAVE to hear it to know its not for them. Pros know what they want. If they want something we don't have I send them to where they do have what they want or at least can hear some more brands.


I do believe in specifications. But quality gear generates quality specs. Cheap gear specs man nothing. I also believe in what I hear and I know what sounds good at home may not sound good at the venue. Thats why My wife mises on the speakers she will use for playback. I have had customers ask what I think of Sony MDR7506's I tell them I have been using them for 20+ years and SE560 ear buds. We don't carry Sony so I tell them where to get them at a good price. I don;t try to sell them what they don't want just because we carry it.

AS ar as having something similar to the Ebay speakers. We don't carry any powered speakers in that price range but I will send them to Best Buy if they want cheap powered speakers and thats all they can afford at the moment.

[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-28-2009).]

Hello Don &Fran,
I'm going to buy Bose L1 or JBL monitors by selling my Logitech Z5500 for the Tyros3 mainly for live performance in church or stage.
Is this Podiumpro 8O2A sound better than Bose L1 and other monitors for getting high quality crystal clear sound and good stereo effect for Tyros3? what sound difference you have heard when compared to Bose L1,Logitech z5500,and other monitors.
Please give your advice.

Thanks,
Sunny

Sunny you wont get any stereo effect with only one Bose L1 system.

ok,what about this Podiumpro 802A speakers?are they better than Bose L1,Logitech z5500 and other JBL monitors?

Sunny

Hey, great to see another review. I'm just a poor amateur so I'm very interested in these, especially since they don't have to be super-great for my usage (stage monitor(s) and practice). The fact that they are quiet is huge.

Just to verify: for that usage above would two of these be enough with a bit of headroom to spare? I'd consider just one but there's free shipping over 199.

I definitely appreciate the info

Just picked up the Protege` 28" luggage roller for the two 802's.....YEAH! only $39.00 at Walmart.

WOW Kingfrog, I understand the "not getting involved" attitude....mostly from unexperienced sales people....It sure looks like you put yourself in that category..

I think you do your customers an injustice, by being what appears to me a true "snob" to relatively new equipment...

I have been in the MI business longer than you, and I have seen these attitudes..they just don't work..Customer's want confidence in the sales person, and sharing your own opinion that is substantiated, not surmised..can go a long way..

To totally dismiss a product that other people have expressed is a very good product..people with more experience than you..is just as Goldie Hawn says is "dumb dumb dumb"..

This OFD company is selling products that compete and even surpass the name brand products...sure the price is low, they are a wholesaler that decided to sell direct instead of jobbers and dealers that share your way of thinking...The price point is also because they have to go head to head with name brands.....Let's see...maybe the name brands are grossly overpriced...You have a manufacturer, and then an importer, and than a jobber, sometimes more than one jobber, and then a dealer....Think there isn't a lot of mark up?

Guys that asked ..the 802's have enough power to play a 150 person room, with plenty of head room..

Are they better than the Bose L1?...Maybe for certain situations, they may just be better....Bang for the dollar, a no brain-er may be even considered..

I will say this the L1 without a sub...give "me" the 802's...and the rest of the money can buy a lot of waffles..:

Kingfrog, I would ask your boss to order a pair of 802's...just so you can compare the Mackie 350's and those Eons too...Heck the worst it can do is sell the Mackies for you..right. .....and than again, maybe you can be enlightened about your closed world...a product you know nothing about..but trashed..because you just know... ...Don't tell your boss , he can't sell them as a dealer..they don't want dealers..

I would say the BOSE without the sub is incomplete and my Klipsh would sound better....LOL They are DESIGNED WITH the sub.


You are right. I am not experienced in sales and you may have operated differently but I am consistently top in sales month after month. I'm the "new" old breed LOL

I don't tell or dictate to the customer what they need. this is not brain surgury. They have EARS, the know what THEY like.Al I do demo what THEY want. Not what I think they should want. Whether a PA or keyboard. I EMPOWER the less knowledgeable to use THEIR ears, fingers, not MY opinion. My opinion means nothing when they realize they CAN hear what they want and further has little merit to pros who already know what they want. If they want to know why there are Grover tuners on a $200 guitar, I tell them. Greg Bennett always wanted Grove tuners as a kid so his design has them at every price level. Is the guitar better because it has $50 tuners? That's where THEIR opinion means more than mine. I inform, they decide. I'm not selling cars. No pressure. No targets.
I can;t argue with the owners success. a two level piano/MI store in a MALL open 12 hours a day 364 days a year with no flooring plan is not cheap. My boss knows what empowerment means. I pass it on to the customer. Too many sales people want to tell us what we need. Want us to believe they know more than we do about our needs and wants. We are all dummys to them. My customers are not dummys.I just have to convince them of that.

I sell Behringer and the Yamaha BR series. AFTER they hear them and they understand the differences between them and the better brands and models,I know when they leave they have heard as much as I can demo and made their choice. THEY MADE THEIR CHOICE...NOT MINE.

I have sent people home without a sure purchase because I felt they were "settling" rather then getting what they want.When in another month or so they could afford what they want. Especially in guitars. I learned the hard way never to settle for something IF you know at some point in the near future you can get what your really want. Believe it or not customer appreciate that and always come back. If a guy wants the 8" $400 monitors speakers but can only afford the $300 5" ers I will tell them to wait and get what they want. Most do and are grateful.

I will absolutely dismiss a product based on the acceptance of like products a particular group uses. Call it snobbery if you like. I call it judicious choice based on my experience and what the group accepts as excellent. Its all relative. We buy the best we can afford for the clients who hire us.

Although your idea is a good one, I would not order any speaker and sell it for 30% MORE than someone can get one on the net. If someone wants a cheap powered speaker we don;t carry, there are places I can send them to read about them.; This site is one of them. I have no problem with sending people to read your posts or those here and let them make their own decisions.

The store owner trusts us to decide what to carry and what not to carry. He is a piano/organ guy not so much MI. We have our specialties and he takes advantage of that. He also knows I am a straight shooter and believe in relationship MORE than a quick sale TODAY. Sometimes he wishes I would just sell, LOL..in fact A lot... but at the end of the month he sees I do exactly that, more than most, so although he shakes his head at my methodology sometimes, he cannot argue with success If he told me HOW I had to sell, I would tell him to find an 18 year old GC reject. Im out.

Call me a snob but I will not endorse anything based on hearsay by people who use computer speakers as a professional PA System. I KNOW computer speakers, I have them, I build Computers, As good as the Klipsch are I would never consider using them in anything but a classroom.

Anymore than I would recommend my Monitor One Studio monitors because I use them or Joe Meek, or Rode in a professional recording forum or to anyone just starting out, who does not have the opportunity to try them.

There are a lot of electronic components that make claims to rival the best at ridiculously low prices....few live up to those claims. Yours indeed may. But I have every reason to be suspect and since am not in the market for $200 powered PA speakers nor do I have any great influence here, there is little reason to jump on the bandwagon.Please Don't take it personally.

You have plenty of people here who respect your opinion enough to make purchasing decisions based on it.




[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 02-28-2009).]

Well, I'm disappointed to hear back from the people in the other forum (Karaoke djs, obviously a target marget, and it is a huge forum) that OFD never did send over a pair of speakers for eval as they had told the moderator there they would. (One of their representatives was involved in the discussion there). I was really hoping for a clean sweep on the reviews

Still, I don't know the whole story there, obviously. The build quality is the thing I'm worried about, and not super sound(unless they were outright terrible), and they sound pretty solid for the money from the reviews here.

[This message has been edited by Stokely (edited 02-28-2009).]

Well??? what's the verdict on the podiums. which face does Fran get? Hero? or ??? Has anyone used them on a job yet?? Why no comments? Friday has passed. did anyone ordered the 10" ones yet, just wondering why they weigh twice as much with just a 2" larger woofer?

Mine are already in town, but UPS doesn't deliver on Saturday or Sunday, so it will be Monday.
I don't need them at all, but I do so hate to see the truck pass my house without stopping!

Many times, I drive over to HankB's house, because the truck NEVER passes him by.
The neighbors thought his wife was having an affair with the driver.
DonM

I'm sure as more arrive people will post their experiences on the Podium 802's....stay tuned.

I too should get mine next week and will immediately take them to a job.

Great Zuki we all await your experiences......I was going to take them to tonight's gig but it was cancelled due to the Snow Storm conditions here.

Mine won't get here until Wed. but I'll stretch them out 25 or 30ft in front and facing me to see if they move any air. I don't need any more nearfields. Although....sounding good at 10ft is good enough for 'in-your-face' stage monitors. We'll see.

BTW, I wish someone would get the 10" and 15" ones, especially the 15's. Just curious how they'd stand up to mid to hi quality competitors.

chas

My biggest concern is that they won't throw the high/mids far enough...bass is never a problem, but getting the high/mid sound out to a decent distance is sometimes only the property of a PA speaker.

These appear to be monitors.

It will be interesting to hear the reviews.

Ian

With a great big honking horn in these, I would hardly classify them as monitors, Ian. The design looks pretty much identical to other speakers designed as PA. Whereas most nearfields use dome tweeters, not horns...

Looks like they are designed for long throw, not nearfield.

Diki...corectomundo these are mini powered 8" PA speakers....my monitors have Ribbon tweeters which are designed for a special purpose...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tweeter#Ribbon_tweeter

Time will tell, my friend...I ain't buying till I is trying, in any case.

It still will depend on the focal point of the horn.

Ian

I simply looked at the speaker, and saw that the horn curvature looks about the same as Mackie's, Eon's, etc..

Makes sense it would have a similar throw (taking the whole 8" size into consideration), IMO.

Time will tell, but at least Fran's review made no note of a rapid drop-off of highs

Diki,

I doubt if I'll ever get a chance to try these speakers as Fran says, "The company sells direct to the consumer...not dealers.."

No big deal, but I'd hang on the side of caution and just wouldn't go on the look of the horn as opposed to will actually do or sound like.

Th focal point still could be too short, and I've already got a pair of speakers for that purpose.

I think I'll save the money and put it towards the two Bose systems.

Are you getting a pair of these, or are you going to wait to hear them?

Ian

Doesn't look likely I'll get to hear them anytime soon, not being in a dealer...

I don't really need a pair just yet, but no doubt by the time I do, they will have been out long enough that the gotchas will be common knowledge. If they wow one and all, I might consider a pair for the house gig and keep my SRM150's for traveling gigs (or vice versa!).

Price is right, that's for sure!

Nope...the price is right, Diki, that's for sure, but they are an unknown product and I'd also be concerned about parts availability and service.

They are cheap, but I don't want disposables.

Perhaps some places will use them for rentals....then we could actually try them out.

Ian

I'm sure you will make 100x what these things cost on gigs alone so you'll NEVER Lose Money on your measily $200.00 investment? oh come now...

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-01-2009).]

If I've already GOT a pair of speakers, OF COURSE I'll lose money buying more...

Geez, Ian. You must have the first dollar you ever made. I just can't figure anyone contemplating TWO Bose systems worrying about 200.00 for two powered speakers. According to Fran, you spend more than that every month on lap dances. Go on, dust off that wallet. Get a pair (speakers, that is).



chas

No doubt I would Donny...but they aren't really necessary with the Bose on the way, and I already have great compact speakers for other gigs.

I guess it's the Scottish upbringing, but I can't see wasting/gambling $200 on anything, especially if they aren't really needed.

Naaaah...I'm definitely gonna pass.

I'd rather get the Logitech 5500 if I was going to buy anything...I already know what they sound like.

Ian

Ha Ha....not likely, Chas, but I don't want to buy just because everyone else is...we're not lemmings you know...

Fran told me that you are so tight you unplug the clock when you go to bed.

I've already got a pair(of those too)and can't see the wherewithal of getting more of basically the same.

The Bose is my little gift to me...as was a pristine 2002 Honda Accord SE a few months ago...these past two years with all the surgery and stuff taught me a lesson.

I hope that after I die, people will say of me: "That guy sure owed me a lot of money."

Remember...The day after tomorrow is the third day of the rest of your life.

Ian

PS... Lap dancing...not for me...that's only for overweight middle-age men, with the ability to believe in the impossible.

Ive been known to throw more junk out the window on the expressway...sheeeeesh!!!

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-01-2009).]

You must have quite a following...

If it works for me I use it ....
if it stinks I chuck it plain & simple philosophy....no pack rat here

If it works, I use it.

If it doesn't, I don't buy it in the first place

Haven't 'chucked' anything for years... My Scottish grandfather would be proud...

Aside from this thread running more then the American Idol all time winner ......
I would say Diki you have to try before you chuck baby... as a reminder don't you remember your EX-Girlfriends! ? if so same as gear!

I hope you weren't throwing those poor ex-girlfriends out on the expressway...

Believe me I've kicked a few out in my wild years as I drove off I threw a bus token out the window also for her...only thing it was 3am and to stay on topic these 802's sound better then my old 1963 Chevy sound system for sure....



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-01-2009).]

Great for carrying you small speakers.....
& the price is right!Just measure both it seems to be a perfect fit....& they look great too.
http://tinyurl.com/dggkwy

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-02-2009).]

Anyone get their speaker stands? http://www.onlyfactorydirect.net/servlet/Detail?no=23

I'm guessing you all might have those already I don't have any and that seems pretty cheap so I'll probably pick them up if I get the 802s.

Btw, they emailed me that they will have the 12" version in a couple/few weeks.

Love that carry bag--hopefully it does fit the speakers, it will be close.

[This message has been edited by Stokely (edited 03-02-2009).]

Except the shipping to me is $15, so, that makes it not such a good deal.

Bill think of all the money you'll make with that miniscule investment on those great speaker bags just on all the gigs alone ....you never LOSE...such a deal

Wasn't someone getting these today?

(not anxious or anything )

Our bass player saw their passive dual 15" cabs and ordered two. As he put it, it would cost him more than that in time and money to build them even if the speakers turn out to suck. Hopefully they won't

I can't believe this thread has gone to 7 pages. I guess stupid posts like this one may have contributed to that.

My trig...uh, wallet finger is getting itchy. I want those 15"(s) but don't want to be the guinea pig. Fran, you out there? Russ? Anyone? Hello.

chas

Actually, I already have a Mackie 808S. Maybe I should just try their passive 15's. The price is right and they've got to sound better than my 12" Cerwin Vegas.

chas

NO,,NO,,,NO!!!!!!!!!!!!..Buy the powered units I want to know how good they are too..

They are on the Brown truck for delivery. Only thing, they usually get to my house about dark. I'm going fishing now!
DonM

Don thats great cant wait to hear your full review tonight on the Podium 802's!!!!

The 802s arrived at my home the same the wife pulled in the driveway All I can say is that I cannot imagine these very tiny little things carrying my sequencer and vocal load - but tomorrow night, late, I will post my review.

I do like the attached power cords, but they are very short in length which will necessitate more extensions or something.

If they sound really great, I'll order the 10s and keep these in my studio - perfect size for my stands.

ARRGGHHH!

j/k, I look forward to your review!

Don't forget 802 people...Line level only!!!!

Important..it will also void your "lifetime" warranty..

You're fishing and I'm shoveling snow !!! ... Well, I've always said life is about CHOICES ... but why do we choose to live up here ?!?!?

t.

They came about 3:30, at the same time as a Ketron SD5 for HankB.
I unboxed everything and hooked the left and right outs of the SD5 directly into the two little speakers.
I left the mid control at midway and turned the volume up to about 8 on each speaker.
I was pretty much prepared to be disappointed when I saw the actual size of them.
HOWEVER, they really sound good. The bass response is very good. It's not a sub, but it goes way down there far enough.
Everything is clean as a pin, and they are extremely quiet. I've had them on for about 3 hours while I reacquainted myself with the SD5 (talk about sounding GREAT; can't wait for my Audya, maybe next week).
Anyway, back to the speakers. They seem to have a pretty long throw, although I only tried them in my living room. They were about six feet from me pointed back toward me, so I didn't ask them for too much.
I turned the volume of the SD5 up only about half way, and it was quickly getting to the painful point.
I think you could use these for a lot of small to medium size jobs and be extremely pleased. They deliver about as much bang for the buck as any gear I've ever seen.
They seem to be very well built.
More later,
DonM

Did about the same as DonM, but with the VA7. I agree that they are very clean, have nice bass and were pleasingly loud in my living room From what I've heard, I feel confident to leave the Mackies home tomorrow for (3) gigs - the last one will be the true test (louder/bigger venue).

Now there is a gutsy man!! awaiting your review

Wow! Using 8" speakers for PA? Or just for your personal monitors and still have a real PA...?

Yes Diki.....in a small room in a NH gig it's called a Public Address system
no need for anything much bigger most times.

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-02-2009).]

Chas did you get your speakers yet?

I ordered mine last night. Thanks for the reviews guys, I'm really excited to hear them.

Tomorrow (Wed). I'm seriously thinking of getting the 15's which I think can be had for $399. Not sure. I'll wait to have a look at the build quality of the 8's first. Between Squeak and Fran, I'll be in the poor house soon. I belong to the "one day I MIGHT need it" club. For the audio range of a C1, I think the K4, acting as sort of a full-range/Sub with two small full-range (802's) on the flanks, is the best option. Nothing else would be going through it; maybe an Electro 3 later on (I haven't ordered one but I'm thinking about it) to sit on top of the C1. I'd only use it for piano, El. piano, and horn stabs, though. I generally hate fake 'sax' or 'trumpet' or 'flute' solo's. There I go, meandering off again. Looking forward to trying out the 802's. All the reports so far sound encouraging. Fingers crossed.

chas

Sunny from India, emailed me..He had a couple questions, maybe someone here can answer...

Sunny is interested in getting a pair of 802's..but OFD does not ship to India...Sunny asked if I knew any dealers that would ship to India..and the answer to that is no...there are no dealers , only factory direct...Maybe someone here would be willing to purchase in Sunny's behalf and arrange shipping between themselves and Sunny..There could be a couple problems, you would have to be concerned about shipping damage..make sure they are insured, and also any defects would need to be shipped back to the USA and then back to OFD...It could be a hassle, but seemly worth while to Sunny...

The other problem , Sunny needs to resolve the voltage issue, these are 110, and he needs 220, any suggestions?

Zuki hurry we are all awaiting your 802 review after todays 3 gigs......!!

Fran posted my comments below

[This message has been edited by zuki (edited 03-03-2009).]

http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/019207.html

Do we have to wait for Chas's review...or do I get my cape now...

Here are Zuki's comments:


These little things are KILLER! My setup was as follows:
I put my extension box behind me in the middle of the keyboard.
I stood the speakers straight up - about 2' behind and 6' to each side (this is about the length of the attached power cords).

I played (3) different venues:

1. Nursing - med size room with 20 people scattered throughout
2. Dinner - med room with 60 people at tables
3. Nursing - larger room with 35 people scattered throughout

I did a sound check by engaging the style/song and checked from the back of the room (40'). It carried well and was very clear. I can imagine these things doing very large rooms with NO problem.

The speakers provided great bass and treble - just perfect. It handled complex arrangements, with vocals and harmonies without a glitch. I did a couple of very loud songs and it was amazing in response.

I had the volume at 12:00 and mid range knob about 2pm (I prefer a bit more treble). I had my Korg at 1/2 volume, same as when using Mackies.

Everyone loved the sound. I loved the sound. I'm sure purist who EQ everything would be less impressed, but for what I do, I didn't find any appreciable difference from the Mackies (I now have them for sale).

Here's what I like:

1. Price - unreal
2. Attached power cords - this saved me time. I hate having separate cords for the Mackies
3. Rubber feet - sit up a bit off the floor
4. Weight - great - cannot believe how lighter my cart was
5. Was able to even get my XB seat up - much less room required for transport.

All in all, you cannot go wrong. Thanks Fran. I hope they hold up.

Zuki.......wow sounds like your in love with the new Podium 802's..good luck to you. Man your selling your beloved Mackie 450's now that says volumes for sure.....kingfrog is shaking his head now hahahahah I'll bet now everyone is ordering them for that price for sure!!
Like Fran said they are better then the BOSE L1 system at 1/20th the price hahah:eek;
Fran is SUPERMAN!!!!!!

If and when I sell my Mackies, I'll probably get the Podium 10s and keep them in my studio, just in case a larger venue comes up. I think I can play everything booked this year with the 8s - they are that good! For a rainy day, I'm gonna also order the stands for that great price

http://stores.ebay.com/OnlyFactoryDirect

This was one of the units I was considering..I wanted a compact high powered unit, but substantial bass...Most reviews say this lacked in the bass dept...

I an so glad I went for the unknown 802's..1/5th the price and I have a stereo pair..
http://www.acousticimg.com/products/prod_coda.html

Zuki, how they hold up, I can't answer..I am careful to follow the factory comments..to use only line level..I have pushed these beyond what I find unbearable volume levels....more than any venue I would have used the 802's...
I have over 30 hours of "more than I would use " volume level test periods ..as long as 4 hour intervals...All with clean, clear results...and the heat sink is just slightly warm..telling me they are not over driven...

Logic tells me , If they didn't act up on my test, I have to believe with normal service they will be fine....If not I have that factory "lifetime" warranty..

With speakers this small, can they be modified to fit on a stand with a small round base like a mic stand?
t.

O.K., Fran, they are very, very good, but I have to stop way short of saying they are better than Bose L1. No way, Jose!
Two different animals for sure.
I do plan to use them though. May even spring for the 10s of someone tries them and they do even better than the 8s.
DonM

Well, considering that you could buy ten pairs of them for the same price as a PAS system, perhaps they ARE better than the Bose. If Fran can barely stand the volume of just ONE pair, imagine what ten pair could put out!

Yes twenty speakers would probably do most jobs as well as one Bose. Have fun hauling them around and setting them up.
As I said, they are at opposite ends of the spectrum. The 802s will be great for small jobs. The Bose is pretty much great for any job, providing you want coverage throughout the building. Not every situation calls for that.
DonM

T....they have a standard speaker stand hole mount on the bottom.They are too heavy for a mic stand.

Don , don't let anyone put words in my mouth..

I didn't say I thought they were better than any other product , except they out performed the Mackie 350's..

What I did say I rather use the 802's over the Bose without the sub,,,

For the size, weight, and price..I will confirm you can't beat them....now if they hold up, they will earn a reputation too,,..

Fran,
Sorry, it was DNJ that put words in your mouth:

"Like Fran said they are better then the BOSE L1 system at 1/20th the price hahah:eek;"

I agree that the Bose sounds like zilch without the sub.
Again, thanks for pointing us to these super little speakers.
DonM

Who cares.......don't worry Fran you'll get your "S" Cape

Thanks everyone!!!!!!

I received my commission check from Sasha...

Just kidding..

Hey we have a new champion!!!!!!!!!!!

This 8 page thread is now the longest post on SZ...In less than 14 days it surpassed the 6 page, 3 year, American Idol post...

Yippee! Mine just came. Still sitting in the foyer unopened (I had to finish lunch). I'll be hooking them up in the next hour and reporting back. We should soon have enough opinions to know which image Fran's face is going to show up on. So far, no Kryptonite .

chas

Still working on the "Man of Steel" picture.

Until then........





-mike

Here is Sasha, the friendly voice when you call OFD....Tell her Fran sent you...

Longer than the American Idol thread...?

So it should be! At least this thread is about something important!

Common Chas hurry everyone is waiting for your review of the Podium 802's........
Fran is sweating it....

Diki did you secretly order the
Podium 802's.. common you can tell us

Not yet. Don't need a pair as I recently bought a pair of Mackie SRM150's for stage monitoring...

Maybe later in the season, if the doubles start making double PA's a necessity.

Hi,

My Podium 802 speakers came this week also. I can't thank Fran enough for the heads up on recommending these super speakers. They sound incredible...& the price is unbelievable I would of paid twice as much for this kind of quality.

John, just send the difference you would have paid ..directly to me..

2nd day on the job. I swear, I like these things BETTER than the very heavy and expensive 450v2s. To me, they have more definition and sound absolutely terrific in stereo (on the floor). I love the size, weight and attached cords - a huge plus in my setup. By the 2nd job, I was smiling while setting up because I know how they're going to deliver. I really cranked them and got super response. For the price - please

Is that really Sasha???

And now these speakers have been
"ZUKI-IZED" and passed the test!!!
All we have to hear now is from Chas...........?....I hope its soon common Chas you've been playing the C1 through them all day

Well, they're out of stock on the 8s now. I ordered another pair. Should be in 6 - 8 weeks. I plan to use as studio monitors. That way I can adjust my sound to have a mirror performance match. If I play a huge gig, I'll take all (4). Now this is money mgmt at its best

Sold Out....WOW!!! I guess after everyone heard the Good news they got swamped with orders on the Podium 802's!!
The early bird catches the worm eh?

Okay. The unvarnished truth. I'm not quite as elated as Zuki. I haven't had a chance to play around with eq or anything so this assessment is based on running them flat (mid at 0, vol. at 5). I only tested them with the FantomG, which is all that was handy. I a/b'd them with the Traynor K4 and then tried them linked to the K4. Here are some of my observations.

1. They sound like what you'd expect from a pair of QUALITY 8" PA speakers. Tight, non-boomy bass, great presence (but slightly harsh to my ears) in the mid-range and good to very good highs. Volume was good but differed significantly depending on whether the input came directly from the FantomG or from the (balanced) line-outs of the K4 (MUCH louder from the K4).

2. Very important. They seem VERY sensitive to 'ground' noise; although quiet when taking input directly from the FantomG, they were virtually unusable when connected to the K4 until I found the 'ground lift' switch on the back of the K4. This helped significantly but still not as quiet as the direct instrument input. In it's defense, I was using a 'mic plug' to 1/4 in. which, as far as I know, is still not considered balanced. Balanced cables might (probably will) make the noise go away.

Would I use them on a gig? Probably not without a (12") sub, but that's because jazz organ bass needs a lot of 'red meat'. For the purpose that I bought them; to add breath, coverage, and flexibility in placement (get those mids and highs on poles and up off the floor), they sound nothing short of TERIFFIC. It's like they were made to compliment the K4. Man oh man, coupled together, they just make you want to smack your daddy (maybe not, think Marvin Gaye ). Would I purchase them again? For my purposes, without a doubt. Can't wait to try them out this week-end.

chas

PS: Fran gets to keep his cape .

She could sell me anything!

Out of stock for 6-8 weeks? Oh No...

Better get an order in.
Hope they don't raise the price because of all this gloating about. :-)

lee S.

Chas enjoy them........hope to hear more reviews from some gig experiences also.

Chas, put those young puppies (802's) on the floor, and hook up the C1 directly into the line ins...Play the ballsy organ bass with the screaming right hand too...Then post again,,tell us how you like them as a stand a lone..I did this with B4 and they can handle it..

Great post Chas. Keep us posted on how you set things up please. I bet the 10s might get the bass for the organ. You can exchange and move up for $50 or so!

Oh, and that's not Sasha - Fran's pulling another fast one :

I just wanted to be the 300th post

That's right, that is the girl helping me build these 802's....we just can't get enough time to keep the orders flowing..

She is such a distraction..

The 10" must be KILLLEEERRRRR and the 15"s OMG!!! Hurry before they are all gone!!

http://www.onlyfactorydirect.net/servlet/Page?template=about


[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-04-2009).]

the real Sasha..

Dream on Fran

The REAL, REAL Sasha.



Chas



[This message has been edited by cgiles (edited 03-04-2009).]

Chas forward slash ..

A confused mind is a terrible thing to waste.

chas

Zuki, the 8's were what I wanted as I never intended to use them standalone. If I had, I probably would have gone with the 12's or 15's. Until and unless I get a Leslie or MotionSound, I will always run the organ through the tube channel on the K4 (reallly warms it up). Got to match the equipment to the effect you're going after. For the venues I play, I think the K4/802 combo is going to be killer. We'll see.

chas

Chas, then that means you give the 802's a big thumbs up?

Fran, stop trying to run the post count up.

Doh, tricked again.

chas

Or as Dan Quayle once said at a NACCP convention, attempting to say their slogan of It's a terrible thing to waste a mind, he said, "It's a terrible thing to lose your mind". That guy was incredible.

After hearing a 12" version was soon coming, I asked for the specs. Here they are:

We are very excited to bring you Podium Pro Audio's Powered DJ, PA and Musical Instrument 12" 2-Way Speaker. This active speaker is perfect for events. Mix in a CD player, rhythm machine and/or keyboard with your voice, no other equipment needed! Sophisticated design and measurement equipment, including computer assisted design software was used to design this speaker to achieve an optimized balance and interface between components to give the best quality performance and longer life. The 75oz 12" woofer with accordion edge surround and 3" aluminum voice coil deliver rich highs, deep bass and are always crystal clear. The wide dispersion titanium membrane tweeter with 2" voice coil delivers extraordinary high-frequency extension due to a design that combines very high motor strength with low moving mass. The four-port port design smooths air flowing in and out of the cabinet, reducing turbulence and port noise. The four ports also increase linearity, lowers distortion, reduces 5th order harmonic distortion, provide an output increase as high as 2-3 dB and help to reach extra low bass.

The most exciting feature of this powered speaker is the built in amplifier. 400 watts RMS and 800 watts max power output is perfect for any audio application. The amp features a combination XLR and 1/4 inch jack input and separate volume control for a microphone. An XLR input for one additional component and another XLR input for second component. An XLR line level output for adding an additional powered speaker. Master volume control knob, treble knob, mid knob, bass knob and 3a fuse round out the awesome features of this built in amp. This speaker is used by musicians, DJ's, rental companies and many fixed installations including houses of worship, theaters, music halls, meeting rooms, amusement parks, hotels, stadiums, nightclubs and auditoriums.

The rugged, lightweight ABS plastic cabinet has a side handle, rubber feet and a pole mount with knob adjustment to secure to any size speaker stand. The angled side is designed for use as a stage monitor and the top of the cabinet has stacking grooves for stacking one speaker on top of another. Power cable and full instructions are included. Priced and sold as one speaker.

Specifications

1 Brand New 2-Way Powered Speaker 400 Watts RMS & 800 Watts Max Sensitivity is 101db with 25-20,000 Hz Frequency Response Woofer is a Deluxe 12" 8ohm 75oz Driver Wide Dispersion Titanium Membrane Tweeter Four Ports 800 Watts Max Output Combination XLR and 1/4" Jack Input & Volume Control for Microphone Two XLR Inputs for Two Additional Components XLR Line Level Output for an Additional Powered Speaker Master Volume, Treble, Mid and Bass Control Knobs Angled, Rugged, Lightweight ABS Plastic Cabinet with Rubber Feet and Handle Pole Mount with Knob Adjustment for Stand Stack able Height 24.75" x Width 17" x Depth 14.25" 43 Pounds All Components Hooked Up To This Speaker Must Be at Line Level This Auction and Price is for 1 Brand New Speaker
Randall
OnlyFactoryDirect.com

Scott without a doubt I would take the 15" version over the 12"..only another 12 pounds and 1,000 watts/ 2,000 watts peak

Scott arent these too heavy for you.?

Kingfrog...where have you been?

What are your thoughts on the opinions of the new 802 owners?

Hard to believe that "PC speakers" can have so much merit!!!!

Maybe they are so well accepted because they aren't "PC Speakers"..

Anyway it would be nice to hear your thoughts on the last few days..Remember one member, is thinking of moving away from Mackie 450's..

Hi Donny

Yes, 43 lbs is more than I'll be moving. I may consider the 8" or 10". How did the 10's ever get up to 32 lbs I wonder, still a bit heavier than I was wanting.

It seems these may be a better quality value than the Peavey PR series and the Behringer B212A's??

I wonder how these suckers compare to my JBL 10 Eon G2's? I have never needed more, if anything I'm asked to turn down. So, I"m wondering what the point would be for me to have the 8 inchers. As a matter of fact, I'm wondering why zuki would consider using four of the 8's rather than have a couple of 10's for the big rooms.

Is there any point in my considering 2 of the 8's to use with my JBL 10's for big rooms? I like the price better and the idea of smaller and lighter. Opinions please..haha, it's the Podium craze

Donny ... have YOU used them on a gig???
t.

Yes Tony I have used them the first night I recieved them last week.

Scott, I bet you'd like them as well as your Eons. If you don't need the excessive volume (these things get PLENTY loug), I'd highly recommned. I'm ditching my Mackie 450v2s and it seems you and I are pretty much in the same venues (sound-wise).

The reason I said 4 was because I'm buying a 2nd pair for my studio and selling my very old DS-90s. This way, when I balance, I know how it'll sound live. So if a job calls for outdoors, huge, lots of ground, etc, I can take all 4 (but I doubt that will ever happen).

My vote is 100% for these for you. I think you could sell them to a bunch of folks here if you didn't like

"


Russ congrats use them well!

D.

Called the order in. They tell me it will be about two weeks. They'll email or call when they're available. Final price will be affected by the current exchange rate. Looking at about $240.00...still a bargain, looks like.

There are several other speakers, stands, etc. they have that I could use. I'll place a small order for these this afternoon.


R.

[This message has been edited by captain Russ (edited 03-05-2009).]

Five people can't be wrong? LOL

Look, you guys have a special relationship here. You play rooms of 30 people.Maybe restaurants, Nursing homes,perhaps more low volume low energy venues, There is a much older group here, with different needs and clients than I expected. That's a different world than we live in at the moment and I do understand your choices based on the demographic. Gary's "set up video" hammered that home.

The fact that a handful of buyers on this board seemed to have created a sell out tells me they are not heavily stocked and demand is not all that. A handful of people bought them based on their friendship and trust on this board.

That's what I think, Fran. I still would not buy a pair reading things like...they are "better" then the Bose, people selling Mackie SRMS...(perhaps the Mackies are too heavy or they are over kill for 30-50 people)Thats not to say powered Speakers CANNOT reproduce 30Hz (The new Event Opals do just that but they have a 24mm excursion range in the woofer and cost $1500 each)but I am not hearing with others ears.

This is a different world than I'm used to and a different mindset. We buy the best we can for the largest venues first, then we consider weight and size. Cost is not a factor because they pay for themselves.

We only want ONE system for all needs. Thats why we bought the Bose Systems.(Not to mention they are universally proven and accepted to a point where 7 orders won't wipe out the entire US Stock pile. They serve every need wonderfully and most venues indoors and out.Really large venues provide a house system. I see nothing that will replace them for our needs.

I am happy for you your recommendation has been met with positive result from the community. I know that's important to you, more important than the speakers may be considering your pride in the pages of interest as well. Good for you. I look forward to your next find. Perhaps it will be something we can use.



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 03-05-2009).]

kingfrog ... Do you REALLY think that the ONLY people who have purchased these are on this forum ?!?!?!?!? ...
And I would appreciate it if you would not be so condescending to say that we all 'play rooms of 30 people' ...

I accept the fact that your career has put you in a higher stratosphere than most of us, but I still cannot understand how ANYONE can judge the merits of ANYTHING with out first hand experience ...

t.

Hi, ya I am also considerig these speakers, my interest is in the 12vs they don't have them in stock at this time, I am now using just 4 k.c 60 rolands,I just started doing gigs, and to my surprise was offered several jobs I also entertain for seniors,I think they are quite hip, they like the 60 and 70 hits,twist etc. they get out there and rock, I need 4 speakers as I use output 1&2 for base & drums, what is the difference in a keyboard powered speaker verses just a powered speaker?the price is right on these and every one seems to like them/////Paula

Hi, ya I am also considerig these speakers, my interest is in the 12vs they don't have them in stock at this time, I am now using just 4 k.c 60 rolands,I just started doing gigs, and to my surprise was offered several jobs I also entertain for seniors,I think they are quite hip, they like the 60 and 70 hits,twist etc. they get out there and rock, I need 4 speakers as I use output 1&2 for base & drums, what is the difference in a keyboard powered speaker verses just a powered speaker?the price is right on these and every one seems to like them/////Paula

Or just the one?

t.
I got a good laugh reading it also another fortune teller perhaps?....is that why he now works in a GC


[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-05-2009).]

Kingfrog, I understand your logic, but you are grossly wrong in your evaluation of performers here..

I can speak for myself....Everything (musical) I own is top of the line gear..

My keyboards..G70, MediaStation.

My sound systems..The best Roland amps made, and top Yorkville system..

My PC's and laptops are also top line equipped..

I too believe in using the best..where we differ, you are associating an unknown brand with not being equal to the challenge..

I purchased the 802's with a specific idea where to use them..They exceeded my expectations, and I shared my findings..Since then, several people (is it five?) have found the same results..

As for OFD sales..they are a specific selling company (speakers), and they have over 17,000 positive feed backs from Ebay sales alone....Does that tell you any thing?

Respectfully..Fran

BTW: my audiences range from 150-3000 people..



[This message has been edited by Fran Carango (edited 03-05-2009).]

WHAT'S THAT? I can't hear you! Either I'm too old or it's the volume from my 6 1000 watt Crowns. Or, it could be the noise from 2500 people who showed up last week for a function at the State capital for the Tourism Commission. Maby it's the 5 piece horn section, or my B-3 with 2 miked 147's.

What do I know about the music business and sound equipment? The patio at the little restaurant I work only does 600 covers in 4 hours.

At least my hearing isn't damaged from demoing $99.00 amps at a retail music store.

Gotta go now...the Andy Griffith show is coming on! And playing next week is going to be a killer...Social Security checks are "in the mail".

Russ "gramps" Lay

its too bad these little speakers dont have a handle,

was thinking about getting these JUST for monitors as i have the QSC and Mackie powered for my mains.

I'd be willing to say some industrial strength velcro attached to handles that you can probably get at Home Depot would solve that problem.

are these no longer available on ebay?

i typed in PP802A and got no hits, anyone?

Lee, they have a mount adjusting knob on the bottom..You can carry the units with this assembly..

Fran,
and you're not afraid of snapping that knob off?

and it would be nice to have custom fit covers for them as i have on all my QSC, Mackies, otherwise i could see these things looking like crap after a few gigs

OR.....how about cutting about a 6" piece of 1 1/4" poly pipe, put a "T" joint on it (for a handle), and stick it in the pole mount hole and tighten the knob. I may try that out. For the morons out there, remove for mounting on the speaker stands .

chas

it's just amazing how there is SO MUCH MORE excitement and hype over these tiny little speakers than there is for the AUDYA.

maybe cause you can buy about 21 pairs of these (42 speakers) for the price of 1 AUDYA :-)

Lee you may have missed an earlier post..I purchased a Protege Carry bag at WalMart,,They fit in the bag fine, well protected and I move then on wheels with an extended handle too..

Maybe because you get a straight answer on how it performs from users

Fran,

no offense but i would NEVER appear at a gig looking as if i was taking the next flight out of town.

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.d...&ci_sku=8586178

you can use this carry bag to haul your gig money to the bank too..

Fran, only if you get paid in pennies :-)

I went to the OFD website and saw that they were only about 1 mile from my store here in California.
I called and spoke with Sasha and introduced myself and my store. She was so happy to find out from me about all you synthzoners. I had her go on line and check out the 300 + posts on our website. They have no factory showroom but get many customers wanting to come and try out their products.
She will call me when more powered speakers arrive and hopefully we will be able to stock and sell these little gems here at my music store for those in the area.
I waited to hear responses from many of you who have purchased these and tried them out.
Sasha, if you are now reading our posts here, it was a pleasure speaking with you today.


------------------
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California
818-881-5566
www.kayesmusicscene.com

Looks like this one is more in order.





-mike

No sh@t,

I use mackie srm450 for my tops and QSC powered subs for my bottoms. go figure....

. double post



[This message has been edited by mc (edited 03-05-2009).]

Last time I'll say this:

3rd day gigging - TERRIFIC! Way to go Podium (and Fran)

Kingfrog, wanna buy my 450v2s?

Sasha, you'd better call me, as promised (Jim Herrmann a.k.a. zuki)

Way to go George. You'll have a winning line, that's for sure Let me know if it happens and you can use me as a reference.

i am glad that someone has spotted an opportunity and not closed their minds as well as their ears. I hope you sell a boat load George.

No thanks..Been there done that...got the cap....Thats why we bought the Bose. Its handles everything, No need for multiple systems or monitors. Bigger rooms provide their own systems.



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 03-05-2009).]

I have never been a follower, and being wrong on this does not cost me a dime. so what's your point

Enjoy them. Buy a ton of them. I'll stick with what I know. You guy rapping about me working in a music store go right ahead. Im here by choice, not necessity. Not to mention purchasing anything for 10% below Dealer cost. I am sure there are planty of people who would suffer a few hours a day listening to chopsticks and drop D chords to buy a Tyros 3 and a Motif XS8 and practically get a Bose Mod II system "free" with the savings. Working for a dealer has it's benefits that go far beyond a paycheck.
A new T4 for the price of a used T3....OK.

And as Long as I am there I can buy the new models for the same price I can get for the used ones.(and medical benefits ) for 4 hours a day a few days a week. Yeah throw me in THAT "brier patch"....


We are not a GC. And no we won't carry the Synthzone "Speakers of the Year" but I will send customers here to read your glowing reviews and as usual let them decide for themselves whether to buy them WITHOUT HEARING THEM like all of you who did buy them.

I am a firm believe in "you get what you pay for". I have yet to see enough evidence to the contrary to change that mindset, especially when in the public eye and on their dime.






[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 03-05-2009).]

No but its seems you got the last five sets....how coincidental?

I judge the merits of things based on market REPUTATION and longevity when I do not have direct access."Frankly" (no pun intended) I don't see the issue with that.

Not that there is anything wrong with it but Yes the general air around here seems to be restaurants, nursing homes (I would love to volunteer playing at one someday), weddings (shoot me first), and generally lower energy events for the OMB players.

Maybe some are playing local high energy dance clubs who knows. But I have more a sense of "Just the Way you Are" over "Big Shot" on a playlist. I could be wrong. You may all be rocking out playing screaming right hand distorted guitar leads followed by the Cupid Shuffle and Cha Cha Slide....who knows.



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 03-05-2009).]

Kingfrog, in our previous conversations, you have never come across this sarcastic...What's up?

mc,

that's funny cause i had Mackie subs with Mackie 450 tops,

now the 450's are my monitors, and i have QSC for tops

so i have mackie subs powered for bass
and QSC powered for tops,
the opposite of you :-)
was thinking about getting QSC subm the 18" but damn its big and heavy

[This message has been edited by leezone (edited 03-05-2009).]

Try the new JBL Eon subs, or the PRX-series. Very good sound and low weight + Crown amps!

I actually stopped reading this thread last week, it not being applicable to my needs or further interest, but was PM'd regarding your question so I thought I answered it.Then came the sarcasm directed my way LOL.

People wonder how I can pass judgment without hearing them yet five (more or less) bought them without hearing them. I find that more far more inordinate and a cause for wonder, especially dealing with audio gear from an Ebay vendor. Then with a few buyers they are suddenly sold out.I would never buy untested audio gear from any store without hearing it based on a questionable incomplete spec sheet That's just me. Nor would I chastise someone who thought they should listen before buying anything.

David Foster and Michael Omartian and many other major producers use different gear and I would suspect none of them would use gear they have not heard purely based on each other's opinion.

Here's another way to look at it. The majority of people on this board have way more discretionary income than the average poor struggling musician. If you look at who bought these speakers (most of whom didn't even have a pressing need for them), for most of them, $200 bucks is 'chump change'. All of us know that Fran's been around the music business long enough to know whether a pair of speakers are pure junk or not. Let's face it; at that price they only need to be 'not terrible' to be justifiable.

Nobody was pressured to buy them. Fran bought them on a gamble, was pleasantly surprised by the build-quality and sound, and decided to pass the information on. The rest of us looked at Fran's review, the weight, the price, and how they would fit our individual needs (back-ups, stage monitors, studio monitors, small-room gigs, augmentation for existing setups, etc.) and decided that this purchase was a prudent risk. I don't think that makes us idiots, as some would have us believe. IT'S MY MONEY, AND I WANT (to spend) IT NOW!

chas

Hey Chas, I am looking at a new MIDI cord that fastens to your forehead...Stay tuned in....It may be what we all think we may need..

You're right Chas. When you hear a glaring review from a repsected musician and it can be had for $200 - why not? This is not what I consider high risk. High risk is flipping houses/speculator (Chas) in this market

Now I'm off to my physical therapist this morning for C4/C5 manipulation and traction. Reducing my speaker weight this past week speaks journals! This is what caught my curiosity. If I had been too cautious (based on specs) to try them - MY LOSS.

Isn't it the norm that things keep getting ligher and better?

I'm not flipping, Zuki. Our general health and my arthritic hip (and knees) drove us to the decision to opt for 'one-floor' living (we also considered several houses with three level elevators). Although the new house has three finished levels, all the primary living areas are on one floor. As with a lot of areas in the country at this time, there are lots of million+ homes around here selling (some at auction) in the 5,6,and 700k's. Unfortunately, we'll probably also take a huge hit if we decide to sell our current home now. The way I see it, at our age, we'll all be dead soon, anyway, why not enjoy whatever time is left. Not that I'm a fatalist. If I were, I'd go out and buy one last airplane.

Also, my life has become way too sedantary (too much TV, Internet, and Studio time). At the new place, I'm buying a nice ZTR mower and cutting my own grass.......maybe.....as long as it doesn't interfere with Ophra.

chas



[This message has been edited by cgiles (edited 03-06-2009).]

Chas ......
High Risk is going to bed at night and HOPING YOU WAKE UP in the morning!

Just my luck

I got an e-mail yesterday that stated that if I used my pay pal account within a certain time frame, I would get a 10% discount on my purchase.

I was ready to stimulate the economy.

Jerry

Depends on who you went to bed with......you may wish you had never woke up in the morning (think Coyote ). Oh wait, this is a family board, isn't it. Sorry, people of good will.......you too, Fran .

chas

Oh, this is silly. DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT help Fran reach his goal of 400 posts. Don't make me post this again.

chas

So many posts.
So little blood shed.
How refreshing.

Eddie

Coyote Ugly...been there...done that!

Chas-great minds-similar experiences.

Russ

(P.S. bet mine were uglier than yours!).

Oh no

Another pissin' contest!

I found it amusing, BTW, with Kingfrog using top studio pros as an example to bolster his point... Of course, when anyone does that on a point that he disagrees with, he then completely dismisses their relevance...

So make up your mind, oh mighty King... Is what they use of any importance or not? Trust me on this one, I've seen PLENTY of top engineers buy gear on the recommendation of others. Do you think they have time to go out and listen in a store to this stuff (where you can't hear a damn thing anyway for all the $99 guitar rig wannabes butchering the latest Shinedown epic )?

Unlike you, they actually have some respect for other trusted pros. Someone with ears says the latest Manley compressor is DA BOMB! They go out and get one...

Remember this the next time you dismiss someone for using fancier gear than you (or even the next time you diss someone for using gear LESS fancy than you! Come to think of it, you really don't have much respect for anyone unless they have the SAME gear as you... do you? )

When the lights are out .....everyone is beautiful..

Oh Man! I thought you guys were talking about Bose 802's all this time ...

If this thread was not started by Fran Carango I do not believe it would have come this far. Now that’s a compliment. ( I may be #373 post wow)
John C.

I can honestly say I've NEVER gone to bed with an ugly woman.
. . . woke up with a few though. How does that happen?
Just to stay on topic, they would sell all those speakers they could build if Sasha would deliver them.
DonM

Could a exterior handles be mounted on to these units without damage to the inside....?
http://tinyurl.com/cq97xc


I also want to add that this company
Only Factory Direct has one of the best customer service departments I have ever used anywhere!

If they can come out with sub, it'll be wonderful

http://cgi.ebay.com/Professional-New-18-...oQQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/Powered-Subwoofer-Ne...oQQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-12-Powered-Subwo...oQQcmdZViewItem

I was actually looking for something in this range: as far as power is concern.
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_107DSW1000/Polk-Audio-DSW-MicroPRO-1000.html?tp=187

Okay, tried them out last night at the club. On poles, about 6' elevation (stage is about 1' off the floor, so slightly above head height), fed from Traynor K4 line-outs, mid control flat, vol adjusted to match the K4, approx. 6' apart (too much stereo spread can screw with the sim Leslie effect) and 2' behind (me and the K4). K4 is angled and on the floor. The real difference is when the club gets crowded and people start to muffle the body level speakers. The club owner (alledgedly) is a pro jazz guitarist so we sort of rely on him for feedback on sound. He was very complimentary and described the sound as 'happening'. In fact, I had to turn the 802's down a notch to get the right balance. Playing is so much more fun when you can hear what you're playing . The only problem; hearing the rest of the group, especially the vocalist, when your instrument is so 'present'. This is always a problem when using a system outside the main PA. Any good hints that aren't too complicated. Just give me the gist of it, not the details (short attention span).

Here's another use I found for the 802's. Some of you may remember a Beherenger piano that I got from Costco for my grandkids to bang on. It looks teriffic but sounds terrible. On a whim, I plugged the line-outs into the 802's and voila'. Sound great? Noooooo.....but it sounded 300% better, good enough to play Xmas carols with the family and visiting neighbors. I may get another pair and leave them in permanently. More later, gotta help Fran reach 400.

chas

Chas, bring a signal from your vocalist into the line in on the back of the K4, you also have a control knob there to set the input level..It will only be heard in the K4 speakers...

Also, I am not interested in 400 posts....I want 600 post..

I am waiting for more feedback, from the guys that purchased the 802's...I think they are amazing....Now if they only hold up..So far they have taken all I pushed through them...

Fran,
If it will help reach your goal, I can do a narrative about the Bose 802s – in installments. It’s sort-a related - same ‘802’ designation. Used ‘em for years – they were great.
Ciao

Fran,
If it will help reach your goal, I can do a narrative about the Bose 802s – in installments. It’s sort-a related - same ‘802’ designation. Used ‘em for years – they were great.
Ciao

Jerry...I heard you the first time...

Chas - glad they worked out in a live situation. I sold my DS-90s and Sasha will get me the first pair to add in my home How sweet it will be to have that power and clarity on stands, in my face - wow!

Wife went with me Saturday night (a rarity) and really loved the sound. I have to say my wireless headset (WH30 is killer by the way) mic sounds MUCH better through this system.

(zuki - master thread contributor)

Zuki...to be a "true SZ Master poster" you have to have a minimum of 10,000 posts under your belt at least. ....
I am now working on my SZ PHD with 15611 posts & counting!

btw glad you love the 802 speakers.




[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-07-2009).]

ZIKI?!?!? ... who is that??? a new member???
...
Donny, I think your post needed ANOTHER edit [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/biggrin.gif[/img] ...
t. [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/cool.gif[/img]

And I'll have tee more martoonis...

Still celebrating the ol' birthday, I see. In the words of Dean Martin, "I knew I'd cut myself shaving 'cause my eyes cleared up".

chas

What about connecting a mixer to these gems?

What about it?

Can it be done?

yes....should be no problem ...I have used powered speakers with a mixer many times...just watch your gain settings 7 you'll be ok.



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-08-2009).]

I live in Amsterdam - can anyone tell me if these are only 110v?

Jerry
Amsterdam

Jerry as far as I know they are only 110v......unless you can use some kind of voltage converter Im not sure about that...anyone know/

The 8s sound very good in my studio. So I decided to use the 8s there and order the 10s on Monday. The footprint is still small and 8 lbs (each) lighter than the Mackies. After listening to the sound from the back of the room today, I'm happy with keeping them on the floor as a wedge configuration. By this time next week, I'll be able to report on the 10s live.

Another day, another very happy camper here

NOT a powered mixer. They take line-level inputs only, not powered.
DonM

O.K. Let's get . . .

. . .this

over with.

FOUR HUNDRED posts in a thread. A new SZ record! And I'll soon be as prolific as DNJ!
DonM

Anyone have or getting the 10s, or am I the first?

It was a new record before the 1st day of March....


Why is it a successful thread...?

First it was initiated by a great respected member...

It had a product that was of interest to most if not all...

The post remained civil for the most part,,just a brief difference in opinions..

It proved to be a success story with many SZ members purchasing the product on ..of all things..based on another person's recommendation..

It will continue to grow..because we all need a friendly, family oriented discussion...and this has proved to be one...

World wide Zuki who knows?......I like to hear a review on the 15's though

http://www.onlyfactorydirect.net/servlet/Page?template=customerreviews

Guinna pig here...yep I'm getting the tens, because by the time I acted they were out of the eights. So I am keeping my finger crossed ( which has made it extremely hard to play my keyboard)Hope I made a good choice since there have been no reviews here yet on the tens ;

Talking with technical, they said the 10s have more bass punch and overall power. Can't wait to call Sasha

Wow, now the 10's...........
this could bring this thread over 1000 Posts!!!

I think SemiLive is getting the 10s also.
DonM

And still no dealer in Australia. Makes it a bit silly when shipping will double the cost.

Dennis

I'll sell my 8's for $300.

DonM

You can buy a pair of the 8s, 10s, & 15's.....for the half the price of a bose system.:eek;

And then haul 'em all around.
As good as the little speakers are, they can't touch the Bose. It has better bass, much better dispersion and much more power, as it should for $2000.
DonM

Fran,
Have you tried 10" monitors? Are they better than better than 8" speakers?Here, Still i can't find these speakers for 220 volts/50 Hz power supply.I hope someone will help me in getting these speakers to India.

Thanks,
Sunny

I concur with DonM.

Maybe a Blind audio test is needed between the Protege line & the Bose

What do you care? You don't have a Bose or Proteges either one!! I have both, and am not blind or deaf either.
Go eat some lettuce and bacon. Without the bread.
DonM

416?!?!?!?!? ... caught my eye because 4/16 is my birthday ...

More importantly, I plug the kb and mic into a non-powered mixer, and go from the mixer into the speakers... yes ? ...
can you add other 'non- powered' speakers to these?
thnx,
t.

you mean like connect out of these powered speakers into non-powered speakers?

of course you can connect them, but do you really think you're gonna get sound from your unpowered speakers?

the thru, or link is line level out as well, not powered

Hahahahahahahahah....yes Don you are correct on 2 counts "been there done that" & who cares?....but I like the Lettuce/Bacon idea for sure just add a sprinkle of Tony Chacheres Creole seasoning also.. I gotta look good for my Sweethearts!

thnx..
t.

My 10s were shipped today. I'll report on them this weekend. However, I don't think I'll be able to use the power they possess, but still will be interesting to see how they sound vs the 8s (at the same volume). Sasha gave me a great price and they're in stock. Someone thinking about the 8s might want to check out the 10s (for an extra $40 or so) and not have to wait.



[This message has been edited by zuki (edited 03-09-2009).]

As Donny mentioned, they have strap handles for sale. Has anyone experimented with putting screws into plastic casing? These 10s are gonna be tough to handle at 32 lbs


[This message has been edited by zuki (edited 03-09-2009).]

it's just weird that the 10's are almost double the weight...

18 vs 32 lbs... hmm i don't know

if the 8" sound taht good then maybe....

hmmmmmm ... Donny says you can put both 8's in a 'wheel - along' bag ... maybe 40 lbs total weight Donny? ... not so with the 10's ...
t.

10's = Rock n roller
http://www.rocknrollercart.com/

Has anyone used the 8" 802's on poles at a gig yet.

Well, got mine. Thanks again to the reviews, I certainly would not have pulled the trigger without the informed opinions here. For me the savings I got with these was extremely important and was integral to me avoiding a used beat up old amp

They sound great! I can only compare them to my old keys amp (Peavey KB300). Not as much low end (that had a 15" speaker) as that amp but I wouldn't expect that. Much easier to carry! They are not as loud as I expected, but I'm suspecting my little Behringer audio interface of not putting out a very good signal. I don't have any other pro line-level gear to compare it with anymore, but I suspect I have quite a bit of headroom left. That said, on 7 they were as loud as I could comfortably stand in my bedroom "test studio"

[This message has been edited by Stokely (edited 03-10-2009).]