The ideal home keyboard

Posted by: dazart

The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 05:47 AM

What keyboard do you think would be the ideal home keyboard.If

1.It will only be used as a home keyboard.

2.It will not be used to sing on.

3.It will need to have a good operating system.

4.Its got to have excellent sounds and good rhythems.

5.Good value for money.
Posted by: nardoni2002

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 05:56 AM

hi dazart,what is your budget?
Posted by: dazart

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 06:22 AM

I would say up to 2000.Possibly more depending on value for money.
Posted by: jm_bogey

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 06:53 AM

If you have enough money go for the Yamaha PSR-2100
Posted by: Dnj

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 06:56 AM

PSR2000 best Bang $ on the Planet!!
Posted by: nardoni2002

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 07:17 AM

more questions you need to answer,what are you using at the moment,are you looking for nice furniture showpiecefor your lounge one or two layered keyboard organ so it would be compact,and updateable, ie wersi,but more expensive, if no, put some of your money by to get top quality headphones or speakers(not necessarilly expensive)yamaha boards are certainly excelent value for money and fit all of your criteria,you will find many people on this site that will point you in the right direction,there are some new boards coming out soon,ie korg,liontracs etc but at the end of the day you MUST try them for yourself,hope this helps,mike
Posted by: travlin'easy

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 07:35 AM

You can't go wrong with the PSR-2000/2100.

Gary
Posted by: eddiefromrotherham

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 08:04 AM

I have been buying organs and keyboards for the best part of 40 years!
As a home player,I have gone from Farfisa to Technics to Wersi to Yamaha to Yamaha to Yamaha
You will gather that I am now an ardent Yamaha fan.
In Yamaha I have gone from 5700 to 740 to 9000 and here's where I have stayed for the last 4 years and I have no hankering after any other. The Tyros is always a next possibility but I don't see the advantages over the 9000 for a home player.
Of course the 9000 as a second user board is now quite inexpensive and it's a hell of a board for under 750 ($1000) second hand.

As you have already read from our members, though , the right one for you is the one that you want AFTER TRYING IT.
Good Luck with your choices.
cheers
Eddie

------------------
Eddie from Rotherham
www.yamahakeyboards.info

my mail is virus-free thanks to Norton Antivirus2002
Posted by: dazart

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 08:15 AM

I have done some shopping around and some prices have dropped.
The Psr 2100 is now available at 850.
The technics Kn7000 has took a steep drop and now it is priced at 1575.

If you took away the vocal processer from the Psr 2100 would it still stand out from the rest ie kn7000 in terms of realism for sound.

I am under the impression that the psr 2100 is a great one man band due to its vocal processer and would be more suited to a live performance.

Thankyou.Daz
Posted by: keybplayer

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 08:24 AM

I'm going to go the opposite direction and say if your willing to pay 2000 [$3,122] or possibly more and you want a Keyboard that fits that [category], I would say if you can get the Technics KN7000. It is an excellent Keyboard. It is a good value for the money in that it's OS updateable, has 'great' sounds, and very good rhythms. The OS, once you've figured it out, is fairly easy to use and navigate. If you especially like Organ sounds you will love the KN7000. It has THEE best Organ sounds of any Arranger that I know of. It has its own built-in speakers that are "excellent". It uses Secure Digital "SD Memory" Cards that you can load .Wav, .MP3, Midi, and other sound and even Video file formats, etc. with, and playback on the KN7000. SD Memory Cards are available in sizes up to 1 Gigabyte and soon will be 8 Gigabyte in size. Just like having a 'minature' Hard Drive. It also has a Floppy Disk Drive. It is Expandable by way of '4' Expansion Board slots. It weighs under 40 lbs., has a built in 'cover' that you can simply close and protect the Keyboard when not in use, and it also has a large LCD screen. It has USB connectivity, a 16 track 40,000 note Sequencer, 128 note Polyphony and comes with over 1,100 instrument settings. It is a top of the line Keyboard that won't lose its competitive edge for a long while in my opinion and should provide you with many years of satisfaction and enjoyment.

Best regards
Mike

[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 11-08-2003).]
Posted by: nardoni2002

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 08:43 AM

hi dazart ,you can get kn7000 cheaper at singingchicken.co.uk glos.uk keep looking it may even be less,mike
Posted by: nardoni2002

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 09:01 AM

mike(keybplayer)i remember your recent test of kn7000 (with a lousy vocal processor)and now that you have had the tyros for a while and this board has opened up to you ,how do they compare now,mike
Posted by: keybplayer

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 09:05 AM

mike, the reason I recommended the KN7000 to 'dazart' is because he says he doesn't want to "sing" along with his playing. If he did sing and wanted a good Vocal Processor I would have recommended the Tyros as top billing, ie., (first choice).

Best regards,
Mike
Posted by: nardoni2002

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 09:16 AM

so both boards are pretty close,mike
Posted by: keybplayer

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 09:16 AM

It is amazing; the KN7000 is a lot less expensive now in the UK than the Tyros is. It dropped over $800 [500]. That is quite a chunk of change. For all of our USA members the KN7000 if sold here for the price they're selling them now in the UK we would be paying under $2,300 for it. If Technics follows suit and drops the price here in the U.S. to the UK equivalent I think there will be a mad dash for many Arranger enthusiasts to get one in my opinion.

Best regards,
Mike
Posted by: dazart

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 09:47 AM

Mike,
Good reply there thankyou.
I am thinking in the same lines as you here in England the kn7000 would be a very good value for money keyboard now that it as taken a drop in price.

I have listnened to the kn7000 next to the tyros and my opinun was aimed at the tyros.But now I ask myself why and it was probably the vocal processer that won me over and the drums on the tyros were much stronger.

I think in a home keyboard drums are not as important as in if you were performing live
and the vocal processer would probably be a waist of money.

A kn7000 at 1500
A tyros at 2000 and that is without the speakers.

-------------------

Regards,
Daz
Posted by: keybplayer

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 09:48 AM

Originally posted by nardoni 2002:
so both boards are pretty close,mike


Both boards are pretty close mike. But the Tyros has a 'big' advantage in the Vocal Processor department. But if Technics drops the price in the U.S. to the UK equivalent with the money saved a person could buy a very decent external Vocal Harmonizer that could surpass the Tyros Harmonizer. The Tyros has other advantages. It is lighter weighing in at 27 lbs vs. the KN7000 38.8 lbs. But as you can see it is only roughly 11 lbs. lighter. Plus the KN7000 has those 'excellent' built in speakers whereas the Tyros is a mute Board. I am still very happy with my Tyros purchase but things have a way of changing so I will be open to 'new' possibilities and purchases along the way. But for now I have no intention of parting with my Tyros unless something comes along that convinces me otherwise. It will have to be something 'revolutionary' that's for sure. The KN7000 isn't revolutionary (as apposed to the Tyros) and Korg's new Pa1X (61 Key with built-in speakers) most likely won't do it for me either by the fact it has only a mere 62 note Polyphony. But I will definitly run it through its paces when it does come out and if the Polyphony issue is a non-issue: well; you never know you know. I might just bite the bullet and get one; sell my PSR 2000 and probably keep the Tyros. Or vice versa; sell the Tyros and keep my PSR 2000. Or sell both the Tyros AND my PSR 2000. But like I said; the Pa1X probably won't be 'revolutionary' enough (as apposed to the Tyros). The Tyros has over "twice" the Polyphony that the Korg has. That is a show stopper right there IMO. But then again only time will tell if the Polyphony (lack of) is an issue or not.

Best regards,
Mike

[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 11-08-2003).]
Posted by: tonkan

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 11:47 AM

One of the most important features to have in a good home keyboard is aftertouch. While the PSR2000/2100 doesn't have this feature it is a very bad home board choice. Unfortunately only the top arrangers have aftertouch.
Vocal processor on the other hand is quite uninteresting on a home arranger.
Posted by: nardoni2002

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 11:59 AM

tell me something,before you used to sing through an amp, do these vocal processors make that much difference,is it that we sing that bad and the processor smooths everything out,mike
Posted by: nardoni2002

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 12:31 PM

mike(keybplayer)email me,mike
Posted by: zalmi

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 01:25 PM

Hi Dazart,
If you have the budget, why don't you go for one of those home digital pianos/arrangers eg Yamaha CVP range? They look great as well.
Posted by: keybplayer

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 08:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by nardoni2002:
tell me something,before you used to sing through an amp, do these vocal processors make that much difference,is it that we sing that bad and the processor smooths everything out,mike


Not necessarily mike. A Vocal 'Harmonizer' is the biggest reason IMO to get a Vocal Processor or have a good one included in a Keyboard. That is; the 'harmony' feature. Making you sound like not just 'one' person but like a Choir of 3 or even 4 persons. It can make you sound like your singing a 'duet' (two singers at once) or 'triplet' (three singers at once "all together"). Granted, some Vocal Harmonizers have Pitch correction for the 'Lead' singer, ie., you/ me. I would say all Harmonizers have Pitch correction for the 'harmony voices' but I'm not positive about that. The more expensive ones have Pitch correction for the 'Lead' voice (you, me, etc.) Some include Vibrato for the 'harmony voices and even the Lead voice'. If you (no reflection on you personally) can't carry a tune in a bucket you'd be very surprised by how well an excellent Vocal Harmonizer can make you sound regardless of how well you can actually sing yourself. In fact Cher is a good example of a Vocal Processor making a bad singer (by nature) sound good or better by comparison. Vocal Processors are getting better and better and soon they will make even a Barney Fife sound like Pavarotti... Well, not quite; but you get the picture. PS: Some Studio Production Mastering Engineers and other Studio Production personnel regard these Pitch correction tools the work of the Devil. By the simple fact that now anybody can sound good regardless of a natural gifting, talent, and hard work. Being able to sing well takes hard work and practice (besides any natural innate ability) for, I would guesstimate, 95% of all singers. Even the born naturals though sometimes they won't admit it, take at least some type of Vocal teaching/coaching courses or Vocal technique training. I could see why some Studio Music Production personnel feel as they do. It can give Joe Blow or Jane Doe a great singing voice with absolutely none of the hard work, devotion, dedication, desire, countless hours training, and gifted talent that a true Singer has to endure to sound good or great or exceptionally great. You put your heart and soul and every ounce of your being into becoming an exceptional singer and Joe Blow or Jane Doe pulls the rug right out from under you so to speak. Go figure. My personal opinion is once somebody/everybody finds out you use a Pitch correction [Lead voice] Processor like the "Antares AVP-1" the wind will immediately go out of their sails realizing the voice they are hearing is NOT really yours at all but a Computer modified, manipulated and enhanced version of your voice. In other words; a fake version of your real voice/singing capabilities. And as the saying goes: "Oh what a tangled Web we weave when once we practice to deceive." PS: If a person knows upfront that you are using a Lead Voice Pitch correction Processor then he or she would know from the get go that what they are "hearing" isn't necessarily what they are "getting" in actuality. But at least the deception has been revealed and acknowledged and the truth has been made aware of. If you can keep the secret a secret then really there is no harm no foul imo. But if you Gig, I for one would hide that sucker the best I could for fear of word getting out - "Hey, Mike's a fake", he he. On the other hand if you could care less what people think or how your singing career turns out then I salute you and at the same time think you're being foolish. So it's better to fess up from the get go or don't use one at all in my opinion.

Vocal 'Harmonizers' like the one on the Tyros, etc., do NOT correct the Lead singers Pitch but only the Harmony pitches. Vocal Processors that use Vibrato in the Harmony and or Lead Voices are quite acceptable also. But Vocal Processors like the Antares AVP-1; well, just talk to many Music Production experts and see what they tell you as to their viability and place in the Music production process. Many of them will sure give you their honest take about them and won't pull any punches and believe me it may not be the opinion you were hoping for.

Best regards,
Mike

PS: mike, you can email me at my yahoo address if you want. It is: seekfinder@yahoo.com

[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 11-09-2003).]
Posted by: Shakil

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/08/03 08:22 PM

Speaking for ideal home keyboard...
I am selling my PSR 2000... http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum29/HTML/001247.html
Posted by: dazart

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/09/03 02:09 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by zalmi:
Hi Dazart,
If you have the budget, why don't you go for one of those home digital pianos/arrangers eg Yamaha CVP range? They look great as well.


Hi Zalmi,
I do play piano also and I like to keep the piano just as a piano alone.Out of the clavinova range I would go for the CLP 170.
To have nice organ sounds and all the rest a lighter key feel is more suited.
Thanks,
Regards,Daz.
Posted by: jm_bogey

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/09/03 06:20 AM

I always say for the same price for the keyboard... is a matter of taste. Some will prefer Tyros, some KN7000, other SD1...

I think the best way is to listen all those keyboard in the same sound system and shut off the inboard sound. Because if you listen a PSR-2000/2100 in is onboard speaker and you compare to KN2600/KN7000 keybaord amp sound system is very different.

I think Technics made is keyboard for the "first impression" looking. It's a board with a "Boost" amp and speakers built in. I had before the KN6000, and if you put the volume at full range it as some little bit of distortion in some sound !

I chage for the PSR-2100 for those reason:

1. the price
2. To have new O/S and new style. The Technics styles are very good, but they have almost a to big background. The fill in don't have enough "Break" pause.
3. I always play with the style and Yamaha is better organized because you could know the kind of intro, ending you will have before pressing the Intro/Ending button.
4. The loading of the styles is really fast: 1 or 2 second compare to 20 - 25 sec. in the KN6000.

If my budget was higher I was buying the Tyros.

Just by the keyboard you will think it will be the best to your ear and have fun !
Posted by: keybplayer

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/09/03 11:05 PM

I agree that a person should try out several different Keyboards and get the one best suited for his or her playing needs and style. Never sacrifice Sounds for features. But if you can get both great Sounds and great Features in a Keyboard at the right price then that would be ideal.

Whatever you choose I hope you are happy and satisfied with it and that you get a great deal in the process.

Best regards,
Mike
Posted by: Tom Cavanaugh

Re: The ideal home keyboard - 11/10/03 07:23 AM

It sounds like you should buy a piano. Good sounds, easy operating system and you can make your own rhythms.