Transpose Button

Posted by: ScubaDon

Transpose Button - 01/10/05 11:27 AM

Uncle Dave made an interesting comment in a different thread:

Quote:
Originally posted by Uncle Dave:

but if you must use a transpose button


I for one must. Often. I'd be interested if others (especially the pros) rely on the transpose button, too, in lieu of the ability to play in keys other than (in my case) F, C and Dm? Also, on the Yamaha, the transpose button goes up and down by a whole note. Is this the case on all arrangers? My present board, a 9000 PRO, lets me push the button (say 3 times for an in-song key change) but waits with the actual traspose until the next chord change. I remember on my PSR-4000, the darn thing would transpose with every click of the button. Annoying. I'm hoping to one day add a Roland arranger to my setup (I LOVE their voices). How does transpose work on Rolands (and other boards)?

Don
Posted by: Starkeeper

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 11:44 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ScubaDon:
Also, on the Yamaha, the transpose button goes up and down by a whole note. Is this the case on all arrangers? My present board, a 9000 PRO, lets me push the button (say 3 times for an in-song key change) but waits with the actual traspose until the next chord change. IDon


I think you mean it goes up and down by a half note. My PSR550 transposes on chord change as well.
Starkeeper
Posted by: DonM

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 11:45 AM

Don,
I use it some. I don't like to play in keys like B or C# or even Db so I push the button sometimes to get into a more comfortable vocal key. As was noted, if you transpose very far, you can come up with un-natural sounds.
DonM
Posted by: ScubaDon

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 11:51 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Starkeeper:
I think you mean it goes up and down by a half note. My PSR550 transposes on chord change as well.
Starkeeper



Oops, yes 1/2 notes. That's what it should have been. A while ago, my uncle who owns a Technics keyboard (never played it myself), told me that on his board the transpose "jumps" 3 half notes or somesuch. Not sure.
Posted by: Tom Cavanaugh

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 11:57 AM

I use the transpose button down 1 whole step most of the time. This puts many songs in my voice range and allows the tenor sax and trumpet to read off the same chart. Most Beatle tunes I have to go down 4 half steps. Sometimes I sing a song an octave down and use the transpose button to bring it up. An example of this would be "Georgia On My Mind". I play it in the key of "C" and transpose it up 1 half step.

Don is correct in that if you use the button to transpose it too far, it will sound unnatural.
Posted by: ScubaDon

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 12:16 PM

So from what I read, it's generally deemed ok to use it even (especially?) in situations where you play with others? I've played with guitar players before and told them to just go ahead and do the song in whatever key they wish and I'll be able to follow along (via transpose). I don't read music though so that works out pretty good. How do you go about it if you rely on written notes? Print the sheets in different keys for the keyboard player and the rest? I have software that transposes sheet music into different keys. I know how to read chord charts, so this has been real helpful to learn the chords to a new song. You mention Georgia On My Mind. It took me forever to get that one right. Great song though when I finally did! Do you have an mp3 of you playing it?

Don
Posted by: travlin'easy

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 12:36 PM

I would be totally lost without the transpose button. From my standpoint, as a singer, it allows me to play using chords that I'm comfortable with, and maintain the chord that best suits my voice. Sure, some folks call that cheating, but I've never considered myself a musisian--just an entertainer and that's what folks pay me for.

Cheers,

Gary

Gary
Posted by: captain Russ

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 12:43 PM

I try to use the transpose button only when absolutely necessary...for instance, when a horn player is sitting in and doing a song I usually do in a different key (don't want to
make him sound bad). For many tunes, it dosen't make a difference, but occasionally...

For songs in my library, I always try to learn them in "my" key. That's because, sometimes I use a house grand piano...obviously no transposer.

That's what works for me.

Russ
Posted by: renig

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 01:32 PM

Yep, me too. I'm absolutely shameless with use of the transpose button. I'm okay with keys C, D, E, F, G and A and their minors, but I flounder to varying degrees with the key of B and any of the # or b keys and, as DonM says, it's better not to stray too far with the transpose button.

On my Korg the transpose shifts in semi-tone increments and it does wait until the chord change is made before it transposes.
Posted by: Uncle Dave

Re: Transpose Button - 01/10/05 07:52 PM

I'll use any tool, anytime, anywhere.
I started using the transpose just to give my voice a break, but some songs are so much easier to play in certain keys that it becomes a neccessity to get the proper voicings. eg: certain blues riffs that require pull offs or quick grace notes. Somethings work better if you move a 1/2 step up or down. I do most of my blugrassy things in F, even if I sing in E so I can use my blues pickin' styles. They just don't work in E!
If I forced to use an acoustic instrument .... then I live with it, but the end product is better with the proper tool.
Posted by: kbrkr

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 04:42 AM

I've gotten in trouble using the transpose button and have trained myself to stay away from it. Especially when you play with other musicians!!! LOL.

Imagine my surprise when they start the song in G and I start in the key of A!!!

I'll never do that again.
Posted by: tony mads usa

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 06:27 AM

Like many of you, I will use the transpose button however necessary ... to allow me to play a particular song in a certain key which 'feels' more comfortable for my hands, while singing it in a key that's more comfortable for my voice ... I've also used it sometimes after singing for quite a while and then needing to sing a song that 'stretches' my vocal range, OR if I have a slight cold or something like that ... I appreciate the ability to just 'drop down' the key at the touch of a button ... of course it's not that easy to do if you're playing with others ... AND, if you've used the transpose you had better pay attention before starting the next tune ... ...
The kn6000 transposes a 1/2 step at a time for I think up to 5 whole tones ... I'll have to check that tonight ... but as others said, be careful for the sounds ...
AND the transpose button is INVALUABLE ( priceless?? ) when backing up someone who sings/plays in odd keys ...
and let's not forget using it for the last chorus of a song just to 'kick it up a notch' ...
t.

[This message has been edited by tony mads usa (edited 01-11-2005).]
Posted by: Uncle Dave

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 12:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by tony mads usa:
let's not forget using it for the last chorus of a song


There is no shame attached to it. It's a legit tool on a digital instrument. Just like a capo for certain fingerpicking techniques on guitar.
A seasoned player MAY be able to accomplish the same thing without it, but maybe not.

Digital gear has forever changed the way music is created. 40 years ago there wasn't even a catagory for digital instruments. We were taught that even electronic organs didn't qualify as legit instruments because they didn't make any sound on their own.
The four groups presented to me at Temple were:
Strings
Brass
Woodwinds
Percussion
No where was there room for anything that created sound without moving air through a speaker first.

To quote Mr. Zimmerman:
"The time's they are a changin' "
Posted by: tony mads usa

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 01:15 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Uncle Dave:
The four groups presented to me at Temple were:
Strings
Brass
Woodwinds
Percussion


... and where in those groups did my accordion fall ???
t.
Posted by: Dnj

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 01:28 PM

so I guess people using the trasnpose button playing everything in "C" AND using the One finger chord vs fingered chord changing is cheating also? Hmmmmm? who makes up these "musicaly correct" rules?
Posted by: Scottyee

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 01:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by travlin'easy:
I've never considered myself a musisian


Gar, me neither. A musician yes, but not a musisian.

Scott
Posted by: Uncle Dave

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 05:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by tony mads usa:
... and where in those groups did my accordion fall ?



Hmmmm. they use reeds right? Probably woodwind.
Posted by: keybplayer

Re: Transpose Button - 01/11/05 09:36 PM

This subject has been tossed back and forth before but IMO to become a truly accomplished keyboard musician you should try and stay away from using the transpose button in all but the most dire of circumstances.

Granted, I do use the transpose feature on occasion, like when using Midi files and trying to sing along in a Key that is comfortable to my range when the song is in a Key that is NOT conducive to my voice range. But when it comes to actually playing the keyboard, i.e. the Keys themselves - I make it a point to transpose using my own two hands. It takes some effort to learn to do it, but the rewards are well worth it especially if you play with a Band as Al stated. Mistakes are bound to happen in a Live situation with a Band and you try to use the transpose feature. Not a pretty sight, as Al found out.

>> Want to be a run of the mill keyboard player and musician? - then use the transpose button frequently and repeatedly. Want to eventually become an accomplished and skilled keyboard player and musician? Then learn to do the transposing yourself using your own two hands and relegate the transpose buttons to all but the most dire of circumstances or in a Studio for - .eg. (special recording purposes), or when using Midi files and wanting to sing a song in a comfortable key. Other than that, learn to do the transposing yourself with your chops when actually playing the keyboard.

Besides, think of the thrill you'll get when you learn all those new Chords just waiting to be discovered! And you'll actually be able to play them with your own two hands with a bit of practice!... Just think of it!

My 2..

Best regards,
Mike