Bose L1 for sale...

I have a friend that purchased a Bose L1 a few months ago. He allowed it to go past the allowable return date and has decided to sell it. He's askling $1,700 with a single sub. It has not been used much, it's in excellent condition, however, he only wants to sell it to someone in the mid-Atlantic region of the U.S. and does not want to ship it--pick up only. You can reach him at JIMSAX@comcast.net

Good Luck,

Gary 8)

What doesnt he like about it?

The Bose L1 system never did float my boat(sorry Gary).

A friend of mine uses one on his PSR-3000 which is only used to play midi files as he plays guitar and sings.

In that context it does okay, great coverage, nice full sound.

But...when I sat down to play his 3k, I was very disappointed in the sound of the piano, which seemed "pinched" and thinner, rather than the great stereo grand piano I'm used to hearing.

For me, the only way to go with stereo using two powered speakers, but if you're using the Bose just to play midi files or accompaniment with little right hand piano, it may be quite satisfactory.

Ian

ok great a morning HiJack!!! !!!
lets start the BOSE wars!!!!

Price, weight, mono/stereo, old version vs the new, setup time, power, coverage.....

we've argued about everything else this week hahahahhah

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 08-31-2007).]

No warring intended, Donny, although your post appears to be an attempt to make it seem that way, now doesn't it?

I'm just voicing an opinion...an observation...nothing else.

Gary is good guy, he won't take offense.

Ian

Gary is NOT a good guy......

Gary is a GOD to me they dont come any better!!! period!!

Ditto.

Just got home from a long double, but the bottom line is he didn't like the piano sounds--that's his only gripe. He said the vocals are the best he ever experienced, all the other instrments were very crisp and clear, the weight was never an issue, but he wanted stereo piano sounds. He waited too long to make up his mind so he's beyond the no-questions-asked return date. He's loooking to buy a new T2 as a backup for his primary T2, so maybe he may consider some sort of trade with someone that wants to sell their T2.

Cheers,

Gary

------------------
Travlin' Easy

The Stagepas 300 (to me) sounds terrific and I get lots of compliments from the elderly who say they can hear every detail. I run my 3K stereo and keep the mixer in the cabinet on poles - doesn't get any easier. It's a very clean sound with lots of punch. I'd move up to the 500 next to handle bigger crowds.

Hi Gar. I don't know WHO this guy is, but as a longtime Yamaha PSR/Tyros2 owner, I too continue to come away with the exact same impression as him, having auditioned the Bose L1 both in the store and on a gig, and then again re-evaluating a few years later, and most recently auditioning thru a S900. As much as I'm amazed & enthralled utilizing a single unit Bose L1 for vocal reproduction & acoutic instruments, I'm simply not won over with it for use with Yamaha arrangers. Going out mono, you suffer the detrimental effects of phase cancellation: harsh brittle, thin sound. If experiencing the rich full sound of Yamaha 'stereo sampled' acoustic pianos & sounds is important to you (as is the case for me), imho, you simply need to go out STEREO.



Hi zuki. The Yamaha ads appear (at least from the pictures shown) to promote the Stagepas300 to vocalists & acoustic guitarists, and not to keyboard players. That said, I'd appreciate comments on the sound of the Stagepas 300's 8" woofers, as I assume you feel it provides acceptably satisfying bass response to handle the broader frequency range requirements of piano and arranger keyboard instrument voices, like bass guitar, acoustic bass & drums.

Also, though I realize the Stagepas 300 total package weight is only 40 lbs, can you provide the weights of its indiviual components: each speaker (2), mixing console, etc.

Thanks in advance, - Scott

Hi Scott,

The mixer/amp in the Stagepas 300 weighs approximately 5 lb.

So the speakers weigh around 17.5 lb. each.

I've used the Stagepas 300 on many clinics, both with the Tyros2, and the PSR-3000...haven't used it on the S900 yet...it is a great system for small venues, and, best of all...it's stereo.

Although Yamaha rates it at 150 watts/side, my guess is that it more realistically puts out 100 watts/side...but that's still a terrific rating for a mixer/amp that is so light.

Ian

8" ?.....
if you want bass you gotta push air

So I guess at 9", I'm good .

chas

Strange...I would have figured you'd be much taller.

Ian, thanks for providing the weight details. Nice and light.

That said, is the Stagepas 300's low-mid to high frequency range smooth sounding, and not harsh (overly bright) or hyped, as some compact PA's sound. My only remaining concern is an 8" speaker's capacity to deliver suficient low end frequencies (not for boom boom disco bass), but to provide enough low end warmth to provide adequate acoustic bass for basic rhythm section combo style arranger mode playing: piano, with bass & drums accomp + solo instrument only.

Ok. Ian, zuki, and others who own or played the Stagepas 300. I'm interested in hearing more feedback details about the sound of the Yamaha Stagepas 300 for a small crowd (under 50) in a small combo concert type as I outlined above. Thanks.

Scott

This system is quite cheap. http://www.musiciansbuy.com/ART-OEX400-L...-OEX400KIT.html
You think it's a case of you get what you pay for?
Anyone ever tried/heard it?
Thank you,
Jim

www.mackie.com

I am going to try and decipher the mod I made to the grand piano in my psr3k when I got the Bose. You see, the problem isn't the Bose at all. Everything else sound wonderful in it. The problem is in the Yamaha, so I fixed the Yamaha. I'll get at that asap!

http://www.rcfaudio.com/

Hi Uncle Dave, not sure what your stereo sampled Grand Piano mod entails, but, as long it doesn't involve opening up the KB and/or voiding the warranty, I'm most anxious to test it out on Tyros2. Please share mod details asap. - Scott

I posted a piano sound at the PSR Tutorial site specifically for Yamaha keyboards used in combination with the Bose L1. It took just a few minutes to create the sound, which is based upon the GM Grand Piano voice, then modified a bit to create depth. A lot of folks downloaded it and use the voice exclusively. Check it out.

Gary

------------------
Travlin' Easy

I find the Yamaha Stereo Grands just a tad 'phasey' even on normal speakers. It just, IMO, gets a little funny in the middle, the edges are fine, but the middle of the keyboard feels just a bit hollow.

How well does it collapse down to mono (say you just use the mono out jack instead of running stereo)? Does it sound weird compared to when it's in stereo...? That's usually a sign of poor phase alignment during the sampling sessions, and is very hard to get rid of if it's in the samples themselves.

The "Live!" sounds in the Yamaha are designed to sound their best when played through stereo speakers.

Whilst some astute listeners may find the "Live!Grand" sound "phasey", it is this very slight animation that gives Yamaha's stereo grand piano the ultra realistic sound that seems to escape some of the other brands(not named to protect the guilty ).

You must remember that Yamaha has been making "real" acoustic pianos for over 100 years(something many other brands cannot claim), so they do know a thing or three about how a realistic piano sample should sound.

The Bose L1, unfortunately, does not reproduce these "Live" sounds well because it is mono.

Virtually any "stereo sampled grand" sounds much better in stereo.

Ditto on board Leslie effects, stereo chorus and delays...they just sound much more deluxe in stereo.

It doesn't take a genius to figure out that if a player wants to hear his stereo sampled sounds at their best, playing through a mono amp just won't cut it.

I liked the Bose L1 for it's exceptional sound spread and it's quality, but it is not the best system for reproducing stereo sounds, in my opinion.

Ian

Scott,

I have owned the Stagepas 300 since last December using it mostly for nursing home audiences up to 100 (usually less). Although I still like this system for the portability and (mostly) good sound, from my experience, there 3 main issues:

1. Some loss of midrange frequencies. I perform using pre-recorded backing tracks and some MIDI files mixed on my home system with Logitech Z5300 speakers and converted to MP3. I noticed right away that I had to do some remixing to beef up some of the more subtle parts such as rhythm guitar and keyboard. This is a frequent complaint with his system.

2. Not the best reverb, although there is a "sweet spot" where it sounds OK. Of course this wouldn't be an issue for you with a T2.

3. The most noticeable problem for me is a lack of speaker dispersion and presence of falloff. If you are in the sweet spot, this system can sound pretty good but it is a small sweet spot. I work one room in particular that is probably 80 by 65 feet with good acoustics. I place the speakers about 15 feet apart and get a great sound. However, if a room is much wider than it is deep or asymmetrical in some way the dispersion problem becomes very apparent. Also, the power is what I would describe as just adequate even for the jobs I do. Speaker falloff is very noticeable as little as 30-40 feet away, but with 50 people may not be an issue.

Good points about the system? Great portability and setup speed. Good bass response for small speakers. Great sound (I especially like the vocal sound) for the money which was the clincher for me. I paid $700 for the system with the poles and roller-case so it was a great way to get started with nursing homes. I am now using a Yamaha subwoofer with his system (just a regular home theatre type) to get a little more bass and clean up the mains.

I play 4-10 jobs a month and if my finances ever warrant it, I would probably move to the Bose L1 but for now the Stagepas is a compromise for me that works for the type of jobs I do.

"You must remember that Yamaha has been making "real" acoustic pianos for over 100 years(something many other brands cannot claim), so they do know a thing or three about how a realistic piano sample should sound."

Ian, you would think they could get it right by now!!!...

They got it right for the right people, Fran.

Ian

http://www.purgatorycreek.com/index.html

You want to start comparing apples to apples in sampled pianos, this is as good as it gets.

You can download the files, put them in a random playlist, and blindfold pick your favorites. Be prepared to be surprised!

Plus, you get an opportunity to see just HOW good the current crop of software streaming piano sets have gotten (and the modeling ones like Pianoteq 2). Ivory blows me away!

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 09-04-2007).]

BTW, the PA800 and Tyros2 pianos (and the new MotifXS) are on their New Entries page (also in the regular Yamaha and Korg Pages), the G70 is the same as FantomX Ultimate Grand..

How about uploading the S900 piano, Ian? The MIDI file for the piece is at the site, play it through the S900, capture it with the incredibly handy MP3 recorder, and upload the file...

I got to say how much improved the PA800's piano is compared to earlier Korgs. They've FINALLY made a piano I can stand (I have a Trton w/Pianocard, before you all get huffy!)...

Sorry...I've decided to remove the link.

Ian

[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 09-04-2007).]

You want to upload it to Purgatory Creek, Ian?

Thanks, BTW...

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 09-04-2007).]

No, I don't, Diki...you can if you wish.

Ian

OK, but they prefer a 192khz encoded MP3 if possible, to make it really apples to apples...

Could you do it again at that rate and upload, or will you be happy enough with it being less perfectly represented?

Send it the way it is if you wish...that's the best I can do with it.

Ian

[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 09-04-2007).]

Fine by me, but I am surprised at how vehemently you defend every single feature and sound of the PSRs, but are willing to let a less than equal quality demo get uploaded to a site as careful about making an EVEN comparison as P.Creek is.

Are you REALLY sure you can't re-do at 192kbps (or does the S900 only encode at 128kbps?)...?

The PSR-S900 records WAV the same as the Tyros2...perhaps my WAV to MP3 converter is the issue?

You should leave it for someone else to upload if my offering is not up to the proper standard.

I will remove my link.

Ian





[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 09-04-2007).]

No skin off my nose, Ian.

If you already have the file as a WAVE, why not just convert it to a 192kbps, and the job is done..? Your converter will offer various rates, just select 192 (in fact, I think that anything less than 192 compromises the sound too much for me for anything!). You can send me the file privately if you don't want to upload it to yousendit again...

All I'm trying to do is make sure the S900 gets represented as well as any other piano there does. Something I thought you'd be right on board with, Ian...

C'mon guys--this started out as a simple For Sale that would allow someone to purchase a great system for well under the retail price. It seems as if everyone wants to write their name in the snow, even in mid summer when there's no snow on the ground. Another simple thread has just turned into another pissin' contest.

Cheers,

Gary

------------------
Travlin' Easy

Diki,

Here is the PSR-S900 piano at 192kbps.
http://www.4shared.com/file/23559103/5fd9f551/_2__PSR-S900_Piano.html

Ian

Thanks, Ian... I'll get it to them.

SOLD!

Gary

Gar, yep, I utilize a modified version of your tweaked sound when I have to go out to a mono speaker, and agree that it offers some degree of improvement (thanks ) , but it still lacks the full body richness the stereo 'Grand Piano' voice going out to two discrete speakers delivers. For situations where live piano comping plays only a background role, it's fine, but for any 'exposed piano playing' of any kind (piano soloing, etc), going out to a single Bose L1 or any other mono speaker system just won't cut it with Yamaha keyboard stereo sampled pianos. My personal opinion only of course. - Scott

Scott,

I really don't have a problem with mono using the Bose, or any other system for that matter. I guess much of this may be centered around the differences in our performances. While I utilize the piano sounds a bit, my vocals are essentially my lead instrument. It's extremely rare for me to perform a strictly instrumental song, and when I do the piano I use is the one I created just for that purpose. For me, there is nothing, absolutely nothing, that compares with the Bose L1 system, and I've performed at some huge venues using the L1 with just a single sub. All of this, of course, is very subjective, and I respect the views of performers who do not like the Bose systems. It has been an outstanding sound system for me. And, I have yet to have a single, negative comment from any audience member, including several pro musicians with impecible credentials.

It works for me,

Gary

Hi Gar , Yep, I concur that the Bose L1 is perhaps the VERY BEST sounding system for vocals and acoustic instruments, and was most definitely in 7th HEAVEN hearing how my voice sounded thru it. So-o -o natural & unhyped. Darn . . . if only there were a Yamaha stereo piano sample solution for exposed piano playing.

Here's is a link to a software plug-in solution & forum discussion about it, but does anyone here know if there's a hardware device available for sale which will accomplish the same thing? If so, where can I buy it, and how much would it cost?

Thanks, - Scott