KORG PA1X OPINIONS PLEASE

HI ya all ya,
I am thinking about adding the Korg to my stable and I am looking for qualified objective opinions on this keyboard. I have read all the specs, seen the picture, but have not yet got my fingers on this board.
How bout helping me out on this. Christmas is getting closer by the day and my wife is pressing me for about "What do you want for Christmas".
I have 4 Technics and a psr9000, plus some others in here. It is time for something new that is truly great and challanging.
c'mon and help me out and thanks for sharing
Bebop

I've never owned that particular model, but I did demo it next to a Tyros.

I found the Tyros to be head & shoulders above the Korg product in terms of user-friendliness. The sounds were all good, except I dislike the Korg piano sounds beyond words.

You should know I had bought the Korg Triton ProX about a year earlier and despised it. It was not the kb I thought it was...I could never get a good piano sound, so I dumped it rather quickly.

The Tyros' pianos are, IMO, far superior...

Bill in Dayton

Hi Bebop , knowing you personally as a good friend, as well as the style of music you enjoy playing most, I don't recommend (to you) the PA1Xpro. Korg keyboards have a lot to offer: impressive more contemporary type of styles & sounds and great production tools, but they also involve a bit of a steep learning curve compared to Technics (and Yamaha). For in studio production work this is a terrific keyboard that even I have been seriously considering, but for taking 'out on the road' with you in your RV and performing live and having fun in the process, you might become frustrated & disappointed. Attempting to trigger the auto-accompaniment part variation & fill buttons, from reports I've read here, can produce unacceptable'out of sync'?! results. This is one of the major reasons I have passed on the PA1Xpro myself.

The new upcoming Roland G70 and Yamaha Tyros II definitely won't be out until well into next year. I would recommend the Tyros but since it's apparent (from our conversations) that the Yamaha OS is not your favorite cup of tea, stay with your Technics KN7000. AFterall, it's STILL one of the BEST keyboards today, and continues to surpasses the others in MANY ways.

AS far as acoustic pianos go, I still think you have the best on the Technics KN7000. It's actually a Steinway sample.

If you're still wanting a music gift from your wife, perhaps a Digital Recorder (DAW) or one of the KN7000's EW series sound expansion boards (if you don't already own it) would be a good choice.

Hey Bebop, I read on the Technics forum: http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum25/HTML/002715.html
that your KN7000 endured a 3 foot drop to the floor. I trust that it has still survived the fall, and hope this is not the reason you're wanting another keyboard.

Scott

Thanks guys for your imputes.
Scott knows my style of playing best and I am inclined to accept what he is saying here.
I think I am looking for an in depth analysis of the boards shortcoming and how you relate to them, such as the low polyphony. the laci of a the SD card system and stuff like that. Every thing I read on the net is hype so I am now looking for the offsetting shortcomings.
I have a complete recording studio so don't need anymore gear for that. I would only use this keyboard in the studio as the Technics are the road warriors, the KN7000 and the KN2600.
I decided not to add any boards to the KN's as I send out all my recordings to the hundreds of people on my email lists in the technics format and if they do not have the boards in their technics then they do not get the sounds that I used, but will get some other voice substitution not under my or their control

Scott, that KN7 is built like a tank. It not only fell about 3 feet but got squeezed by the bedroom slideout and it didn't hurt it a bit. I will prolly keep this board for ever but just looking for something new and challanging. maybe i will go back to blowing my horns or even playing my accordion or guitar
Thanks guys
anyone else have comments I can soak up??
Best to all always
Bill the Bebop

[This message has been edited by BEBOP (edited 11-09-2004).]

Bob,
Why don't you go to Guitar Center and try PA1X for 3-4 weeks. They give full 30 days refund and they DO price match the last time I shopped there last year.

Then after that, you can try TYROS for another 3-4 weeks and then make your decision.

That's what I did previously while searching for a new board. But unfortunately for GC, I bought the PSR2000 elsewhere after trying all those boards. I just could not pass up the opportunity of buying it for a mere $550

-Han

HI BEBOP ,I LIKE MY PA1X PRO, but it is a diferent ballgame from technics what you used to, had this board since april, 20 gig drive, the key feel exelent sounds are nice, no speakers, can play it through my kn 6500, harmonizer not at all like technics, you can use sample sounds and create samples, good forums, the german one is exellent,I love it and do not regret getting it,this is my opinion only,if you can try one out do so, i am still ex ploring it, lots of add ons,but not cheap . BEST REGARDS BENNO

Hi Benno, can you please tell me if you're experiencing any glitches (out of sync timing problems) while playing the PA1X Pro live in auto accomp mode, when triggering (via buttons): variation changes, endings, intros, or fills? I remember reading reports of this problem by several people here a while back, and was wondering if Korg ever corrected this or not. Thanks. - Scott

Hi Scott,
Here's my report ....

I have not heard any glitches .... with fill ins and variations on the PA keyboards here in my store and no customers have complained .

I'm going to try and get some demo's up on my website ....... Dan O'

Hey Dan, thanks for the good news! I'm curious to find out if this was corrected by Korg with a hardware fix, or thru a OS software update?

The sz member reported variation button transition timing problem was the main thing that was holding me back from even considering the PA1X Pro, because as a former Korg keyboard player (01/WFD) I really miss many of those classic Korg sounds, as well as the more contemporary Korg style patterns. Though I have some style conversions of these on my Tyros, it doesn't (and won't) sound nearly as good as they would on the PA1X itself. Now if only Korg would just add rootless voicing recognition to their arrangers. Korg, are you listening?

Dan, I'm hoping you might record something 'live' (in auto accomp mode) on the PA1X Pro, and trigger a few intro-variation-ending & fill changes, to demonstrate not only how the live transitions sound, but showcase your terrific arranger keyboard playing talent as well. I've witnessed Dan in person on the arranger keyboard at NAMM & on video, and he definitely doesn't disapoint.

Dan, does your store (KeyboardCity) currently stock the PA1X and/or PA1X Pro?

Scott

Scott,

I noticed the timing problems with some older styles that were carried over from PA80/60 keyboards. I am almost sure that the timing issue was more of a style programing issue and not a hardware issue. I haven't got a chance to check the styles with the latest OS release 2.0 yet.

When I had the PA80, the timing issue was the only thing that I really hated, especially going from a Yamaha PSR2000 to PA80, it was really annoying. This was the first thing I checked when I bought PA1X and I am really satisfied.

HI SCOT ,HAVE NOT HAD ANY PROBLEMS SO FAR WITH ANY OF THESE MENTINEND GLITCHES, BEST REGARDS BENNO

Here's a few real world items that may influence your decision:
1) Polyphony is rather light. At 62 notes, you can use this up pretty quickly with layers or sequences.
2) Access to styles during seq playback is forbidden. You can locate them, but you can't change one, or have or ready when the seq is done. Same in reverse if you are in acc mode...you can't access the sequencer in live mode.
3) Sounds shut off when new ones are triggered. This is only a problem if you switch alot in the middle of a phrase, or with the sustain pedal down to free up a hand for navigational purposes. If you switch between Program and Performance mode the current sounds shuts down for a second during the switch.
4) No option to add live drum beats to a seq like Yamaha and Ketron do. I've come to love that feature. I like to "modernize" some older sequences by adding some new, hip beats to them....even a multipad adds alot.
5) Some drum fills are still a bit unconventional, and busy compared to the style. (Volumes, instruments etc .....) You may want to tweak the problem areas.
6) Effects mixer is pretty cryptic with only 4 sends. I prefer the Yamaha design where I have control over each sound's EQ, FX, Vol etc in a separate window. Nothing shared like the FX buss in the PA series.

The tone of this kb is AWESOME.
The drums samples are AWESOME.
The O/S is cumbersome, but learnable. Korg lingo takes a while to sink in, but once you "get it", you own it.

I thaught the polyphony on the Korg (62) really did not matter because of the way they alocate the sounds.

PLEASE EXPLAIN THIS REMARK AS POLYPHONY IS VERY IMPORTANT AS I PLAY FULL CHORDS IN BOTH HANDS.
BEBOP

Bebop, do you have 62 fingers?!

Genesys is right. Different keyboard manufacterers allocate polyphony (and note stealing) differently, so the actual number of notes you're able to play concurrently can vary greatly depending on a specific keyboard manufacterer's sound allocation system. More confused now? - Scott

It's a simple math equation. Korg does a great job of placing importance on lowest and last note priority, and they DO handle dropouts vey well, but the simplest truth is this:
The unit will NEVER produce more than 62 notes an any given time, so add it up:

Rhythm style is playing a simple trio backing.......uses maybe 8 notes(conservative)
2 handed chords playing piano, layered with strings ....say 16-20 notes for each key stroke. That's at least 26 so far....probably more like 30 or more.
Hit the sustain pedal just ONCE, and BAM! You're at 60 in a heartbeat.

Most Korg styles are 4-8 parts, so the rhythm alone is most likely using as much as 12 or more voices.

You have to listen as you play. If you get severe drop outs, you may be able to thin out the arrangement, or use teh sustain less.

The sustain pedal is the number 1 ememy of polyphony. If you use it light;y, or not at all ..... you may never have issues.

Scottyee and UD are both right.
Also, if you are going to use that keyboard in the studio, polyphony should not be a problem for you.

I would say that the weight and the touch screen depending on your style of playing are not the best thing.
However, since you are going to use it in the studio those also should not be a problem for you.

I have just read every word on the Korg site about the Pa1x Pro and I begin to feel like I am getting hooked. This box is awesome
PA1X lists at $4300.00 USD.
The PA1X PRO with 76 keys, Harddrive, no amp or speakers lists at $4500.00 USD. I am sure substantial discounts must abound
check it out at: http://www.korgpa.com/pa_root/en/news/news.html?en
New OS is 2.0 and now available.
Thanks to Beeno for sending me this URL to look it over
Best to all
BEBOP

[This message has been edited by BEBOP (edited 11-14-2004).]

I have a PP!X pro for sale Bebop ....
Check for sale + wanted section ...
Price negotiable..

sorry.. obviously should have read as PA1X PRO.

Thanks JDX,
But...........you are in France and I am in California and that preposes a lot of problems.
I also note that your asking price for used is more in USD then George Kaye is for new right here on my Turf in Sunny California.
Besides that I don't like to buy used unless it is half price like used should be
Thanks anyway.
Bebop

OK, Wow. LOts of information...I have had my PA1XPRO for several monthes. I play very complex arrangements live & studio work. Have not noticed a single dropout. Now based on what was given here... I should here drop outs so WHY DON'T I?

You line in CA, Get yourself a PA1XPRO, READ THE MANUAL (IN DETAIL) more than once before you get the board delivered. Try this baby out yourself, NO IT's NOT A YAMI! So what!
It is absolutely awsome! And the keybed quality is professional level, unlike some. No it's not light, quality is not light. How long do you want to use it before it is woen out? For me ... many years!

It is VERY programmable, and I mean VERY. I love that. I use it to drive 2 external modules. Kurzweil PC2R and Roland Fantom module. It has programming to make that super easy!

The sounds are excellant! No not all of them, does any board have all excellant sounds. The user interface is great, especially with V2 OS.

If you really don't like it, send it back.

Lee

You do know you can edit your postings rather than just adding an extra one ?

HI HAN,
Go to Guitar Center? That is how I ended up with the PSR9000 that is sitting in here still brand new, and unused after a year.
I thought I was listening to the yam I was playing but instead I was hearing a mix of 27 other keyboards all being played at the same time in the demo room.
Somehow I don't think it is a good idea to try to check out a keyboard at GC.
Anybody else around our area have this keyboard in stock where you could actually hear it and get it demo'd to you?
Han, I still have your new Synthzone T-shirt that Nigel and Kerry gave you at our west coast Jam as well as your camera stand you forgot.
Bebop

Thank you to all that posted on this thread. I appreciate your imputes. I am more undecided now then I was before.
Uncle Dave, you really gave me something to think about in your post.
I may be in the process of changing my mind about this board. I may just wait til next year and see what turns up.
This forum is still the best source for unbiased information and a great place to starting research on a board before you get your hands on one. Thanks again to all.
Maybe I will get to try one out along the trail from California to the Florida Synthzone jam in the spring, (April). Maybe I will get to try some others out as well and just bring a new one home with me in the motorhome.
My wife always gives me a IOU for a new kehyboard at Christmas time if I don't have one already picked out with a negotiated price just waiting for her to stop at the store and pick it up. Bless her grits
Any more imputes for this thread before I let it go to the back pages??
Thanks to all
Bebop