Solton SD1 Keyboard Dilemma !

After hearing Notlos' wonderful demos performed on the SD1, I have become even MORE interested in possibly purchasing the SD1.

Today I spoke with one (if not the ONLY) San Francisco Bay Area "Mainstream" music store dealer who STOCKS Solton brand keyboards. I inquired about the new SD1 and he told me that he probably 'won't be carrying it' but might be able to 'special order' one pre-paid of course. I asked him WHY his store wasn't planning to stock or even have a demo model available to audition.

This dealer (also an AVID Solton keyboard fan and PRO keyboard player) explained to me that he thinks that Solton keyboards are the BEST pro arranger keyboards out there, but that the US distributor for Solton has not been providing much support to him as a dealer. Apparently (at one time) Bell Solton NY had a "West Coast sales rep" but that this is NO LONGER the case. My local dealer then said there really is NO longer an incentive for him to carry or promote Solton keyboards because the US distributor (Bell Solton) has not been responsive to his store's or his customer's needs. He added that if Solton KB warranty service was needed, that the keyboard would have to be shipped all the way back to New York (Bell Solton) because no local keyboard repair center would be WILLING to work on it. On top of this, he said that "Bell Solton would not provide his store with any 'demo' keyboards, even though (according to him) their store had sold MANY Solton keyboards in the prior year. He explained that other major keyboard brands (Roland, Yamaha, Korg, etc) ROUTINELY supply dealers with a demo keyboard when sales are good on their product line. He then reiterated that this situation has been frustrating because he still thinks that the Solton arranger keyboard line is the BEST arranger keyboard on the market. This guy is no 'fly by night' dealer and is a popular local bay area music store chain in business for MANY years, so I tend to respect what he had to say. Of course I don't know EVERYTHING behind his comments but it certainly is causing concern on my part because (as the dealer said himself), he thinks that Solton Keyboards are GREAT products and are just missing the boat on the US distribution/marketing end of things.

I'm sure that George Kaye in Southern California probably has a VERY different take on all this, but I still wonder WHY there are so FEW dealers in the USA who will 'keep in STOCK' Solton keyboards. Could this local dealer of mine have provided some important clues?

Feedback much appreciated from ALL,

- Scott

Hi Scott,
Just for your information.
Today I called my local dealer and told him I could pick up an SD1 in Germany only 80 km from here. (Musik Produktiv)
My patience is not endless and I'm pretty close to the 'end'..... after more than 6 months waiting.

I really had plans to cancel my dutch deal (distributed from Belgium Bruxelles) today and buy one in Germany. BUT My dealer will get the SD1 next week ..... promised by the Benelux distributor !!!
My patience ends at wednesday next week.

Roel

Scott, In my past experience as a Solton dealer, I can assure you I never had a problem ordering even a single unit from Lou. As far as service, there was never a problem, a store with a professional repair tech with approval of Lou[should be qualified]. Techs were paid properly as with other manufacturers and their distributors. In all my 20 years as a retail music store owner,I cannot recall a demo[free?]unit furnished by the BIG guys. I have purchased units as Rep demo units at distributor cost, BUT Nobody gives you anything..As a side note, when you see Star performers on TV showing Yamaha,Korg and Kurz products, they are usualy donated or furnished by the Manufacturers. What you will not see is the same by Roland.When you see it on stages the performer purchased it[ that means they prefer Roland]..Fran

Hi Fran: Perhaps my local Solton dealer had MEANT receiving a demo unit at 'distributor cost', he really didn't specify exactly. He just seems to have lost the 'incentive' to promote & stock Solton keyboards now even though he still loves the product line itself.

BTW, I also called the OTHER San Francisco Bay Area authorized Solton music store dealers (provided to me by Bell Solton NY) and they too would NOT stock the SD1. In fact they don't even stock the X1 (at least the first dealer does). Everything has to be ordered on a 'special' pre-paid basis. It's INTERESTING that I am not able to find even 'one' SOLTON dealer in the ENTIRE San Francisco metropolitan region (population over 3 million I'm sure) who is willing to have even one SD1 on the sales floor available for us potential customers to play. I think MOST people need the opportunity to try (audition) BEFORE they buy, especially on a high ticket item such as this.

Interesting to hear about Roland keyboards seen on TV performed by STAR performers. I wonder WHY Roland opted not to donate/furnish their KBs in exchange for publicity, while the OTHER big Guys do? Afterall, the Roland LOGO (free adversting) is as large and as easily seen as the OTHER manufacterer's logos.

Roel: My thoughts are with you MAN! Let's Keep our fingers crossed that your SD1 will arrive by 'next' Wednesday

- Scott

[This message has been edited by Scottyee (edited 06-26-2001).]

Good news,
The SD1 will be soon in the shops in
Germany,Belgium and the Netherlands. A tech-
nician tolled me it could be in November or
December allready. There are still some small
problems in the hardware and in the software
but they can be solved.

Hello Bevan,
Your message is "good news" ?
I'm not sure your posting is serious or just a joke.... ;-)
As far as I know the SD1 ARE available but only in SMALL amounts. For example serveral dealers ordered 30 or more but got only 1, 2 or 3 SD1's.
Dirk Baert has one and created great demo songs.
BTW To whom did you talk ?

Roel

Bevan: Could one of the SD1 software issues you mentioned possibly include FINALLY implementing the jazz (rootless) chord voicing recognition that was PROMISED (in the release version of the SD1) by Sandro back in January? These specific jazz chord voicings are ALREADY recognized by the Technics KN6500 & Yamaha 9000 keyboards. - Scott

Scott,

We have similar problem here in Toronto Canada. There are 3 large music dealers in Toronto that are also Ketron dealers. 2 of the dealers have the X1 on display. They are trying to clear out of the X1 due to poor sales. They will not order / stock the SD-1. They do not want to get stuck with another high-priced item that they can not sell. The Canadian Ketron dealer prices are just too high and the dealers can't afford to take the risk to promote them. The only way I can tryout a SD-1 is to drive 4 hours to Montreal where the Ketron distributor has a showroom there. The Ketron distributors should provide "demo" keyboards to dealers at a lower cost so that dealers can put them on display.

Henry

Henry
I talked with someone at FNZ marketing in Montreal. He told me to call "Mario" at 1-514-273-9912 (FNZ) and there was a possibility that the SD-1 could be shipped to a 'local' store for a tryout. I live in southern British Columbia and at this point-I don't want to be obligated- but If I can't find one on the west coast, I may have to -.

[This message has been edited by Gord (edited 06-26-2001).]

Gord,

I talked to Marcel Beaulieu at FNZ many times and he never offered to ship one to a local store. He asked me to drive up to his showroom to try the SD-1. I don't think the SD-1 are instock yet, may be just a few. If he has any extra ones, he would have called me 'cause I told him that I'm definitely interested in one. I think they should have some in a few weeks.

Did you get any pricing on the SD-1?

Henry

Henry
The Fellow I talked to At FNZ, Montreal said
'suggested' retail for the SD-1 was $5695 Canadian plus tax (in British Columbia, add l4%) Don's piano at St Albert, Alberta quoted
$5295 Canadian If you could find it in the U.S. for around $3000 U.S. X 1.52 Exchange on our lousy $, add around 6 % duty plus 7% Gov service tax you come up with $5171 Canadian-still a heathly bit of Cash

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[This message has been edited by Gord (edited 06-26-2001).]

Gord, thanks for your info on SD1's pricing. I have a friend who works for a Ketron dealer and he thinks he can get me a SD-1 at around $4000 plus taxes (15% in ONT) pre-paid. That's not too bad... Or I could consider ordering from oversea at SynthPlanet for about $2200 USD. But the first thing I need to do is decide whether this is the keyboard for me. And I really need to play it before making any decision...

Henry

Henry
The total Canadian price for a SD1 from synthplanet without a Video Output is-
1. Basic SD1 =$1927 US
2. Step up/step down voltage converter –VOCA –200 (200watt unit to ensure proper operation)=$35 US
3. Total US =$1962
4. $1962 US x 1.52 (exchange to our lousy $)=$2982.24 Canadian
5. $2982 Canadian x 6% duty=$3161 Canadian
6. $3161 x 7%Gov service tax(first)=$3382
7. $3382x7%Prov. Sales Tax(second)=$3619 (Canada customs said I must add PST for British Columbia –but I don’t know if this is Canada wide for all provinces.
8. Shipping from Synthplanet =$119 US x 1.52 Canadian =$181.00
9. Grand Total =$3619 + $181 =$3800 Canadian
If your friend can get it for you at $4600 Total price-then you have to consider if no warranty and 220 Vac operation is worth the
$800.00 Savings. I wonder if your friend would let us know the repair agency's name
&phone number in Montreal (I assume its located there) Who knows, I may find one in the U.S. this fall & I would like to check with them regarding repairs.




[This message has been edited by Gord (edited 06-27-2001).]

Gord,

Thanks for your thorough break down of the cost of importing from oversea to Canada. The taxes & duty really add up. I guess we have to pay the 2 taxes whether you buy it here or not. If you buy it from Ontario, you probably don't have to pay Ont sales tax (ie. have my friend ship it directly to you).

Saving $800 is good, but I don't like the thought of using a 200W 220V step up converter. It seems so inefficient and wasteful. It's one more piece of equipment to carry too.

The lack of warranty doesn't worry me so much. I had more than a dozen keyboards in the pass 15 years and never had a bad one. I had a Ketron X4 and it was a very high quality product.

To sum it up, I definitely would buy a SD1 locally through my friend. I'll talk to Marcel at FNZ again and see if he can arrange for a demo closer to Toronto. I'll keep you posted.

Henry

Henry
Thanks for the 'offer' (your friend selling me an SD1). After my trip down to the Northwest States this fall-I should be able to put an order in-hopefully for the SD1. Let me know if you were able to try out the SD1 in the Toronto area.

Like I said before, I was really IMPRESSED with the beautiful SD1 demos songs performed by Notlos. What a superb musician he is to be able to produce such professionally polished songs on JUST a 'single' keyboard alone. WOW!

In spite of this (as mentioned earlier by Henry01), I think it's very IMPORTANT to "reiterate" that we still MUST take the time to AUDITION for ourselves ALL the keyboard(s) we are considering for purchase, BEFORE laying down our hard earned cash, especially for such a BIG ticket item.

ALL the top-emd arranger keyboards on the market are excellent now, but each has its' own unique strengths & weakness'(OS design, button/screen layout, keyboard size, feel, arranger styles, sounds, features, etc). What might work well for one person may NOT be suitable for another. Your decision really is a PERSONAL thing. That's what makes this world such a wonderfully diverse place afterall.

I'm STILL looking for a store around here (San Francisco Bay Area) that will be willing to 'stock' the SD1 so I can AUDITION it myself again to determine if this is the BEST keyboard for "ME". - Scott

PS: I received word from Bell Solton (New York) today that Sandro (Solton-Italy) is 'still' PROMISING to implement rootless "jazz chord" voicing recognition in the SD1's FIRST OS upgrade (to be released VERY soon). I'm STILL waiting.

Hi everyone,

I got my SD1 today. It is very good... It's midnight here in Toronto and I'm still playing with my new SD1... There is so much new stuff, it's much easier to navigate than the X1/X4.

The pianos are very good... The grand piano is a European grand, very rich and very European. It's different from Technic's or the 9000Pro's.

Oh. I used the PC cable and software from my old X4 and it worked perfectly (well, I only tried downloading files to my PC, don't know if upload work or not). I backed up the original files from the SD1 to my laptop. There were about 5MB of stuffs on it (out of 6.3GB of space). The backup only took a few minutes.

Those live drums are so cool... I'll write some more next time...

Henry

[This message has been edited by Henry01 (edited 07-04-2001).]

It's interesting that you think the piano in the SD1 is so different than the 9000pro. I have listened to the two over and over again in my store and I think they sound exactly the same except for the deeper tone of the SD1 below middle C. This is ot bad. I just think Ketron sampled the Yamaha piano.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene

Henry,
Congrats with your SD1.....as I wrote many times before : "I expect mine VERY soon"
(Tomorrow or next week ?)
About the PC interface :
What cable/software did you use to dump the HDD contents ? (Do I need to buy a 'special' or is it just standard? ..... what was the price ?)

Roel

Roel,

Just hang in there a bit longer, I'm sure your SD1 will arrive soon... And it is definitely worth the wait.

I purchased the PC cable & software ($15 USD) for the X1 previously when I had the X4. The software could also be downloaded directly from Ketron's web site under software downloads. There are 2 parts, the XPC driver and the XFT file transfer software. The software is written for X1/X4 and I don't know for sure if it is compatible with SD1. I expect Ketron to release one for SD1 soon. I have downloaded all the files from all folders in the SD1. But I have not tried uploading until someone can tell me that it is safe to do so. I don't want to mess up the hard drive. There are 16 demo songs and the downloaded midi files played perfectly in my PC except some of the sounds did not map properly.

The cable could easily be made if you know how to do it. It's D-9 serial female to DIN 8 male. For 15 bucks, I didn't want to bother to make my own cable.

Henry

George,

The 9000Pro's Live Grand Piano seems to be sampled from a Yamaha Grand. The SD1's Grand Piano is a European Grand with darker & richer tone. The lower end also is richer & deeper. I'm using a pair of studio reference monitor speakers and I can hear subtle differences. Sound is very subjective though, it also depends on the EQ and effects. In general the SD1's presets have more effects than 9000Pro's presets.

Henry