I was about not to post this, I feel embarrassed with Nigel because of the abuse that is going on in this Forum, and I could not hold it any longer, so here it is....

Is very shameful that "grown" persons chronologically ONLY, are attempting to CHANGE the importance of this forum that offer information, exchange of tips and shortcuts for our arrangers(Normally),etc., and now have became to say the least, their ground of harsh and unacceptable behave, that makes them hardly role models to follow.
I know is a free country, the question is, WHY are they doing it? I came with the only logic answer I could think of:

There is way to much time in their hands, they certainly, for what I had heard(music wise), could USE that precious time to PRACTICE and LEARN to PLAY and improve their "music" skills and themselves instead of immature, childish bully behaving, and may I also add, NOBODY like Bullies.

Manuel Dorantes

Wow !
I swear, I was just about to start a post called "any YOUNG, unseasoned musicians out there?" ( serious ! )

As I'm about to start a new adventure in education .... I wanted to see if I could get some input from the 6th through 12th graders out there. I know us "old heads" learned on manual instruments, but this next wave of musicians has grown up with a remote for everything, no wires, and the ability to cut and paste their hearts out !
(some, literally !)

I used to read every issue of "Keyboard" magazine, but I lost interest as the articles became more like computer software ads. Is this the direction that our youth really WANTS to go?
Do I need to address every new, fadish software program to keep their interest?

I sure hope not. I'll be teaching recording and engineering on a basic ProTools setup, as well as theory, harmony, dictation and instrumental performance techniques. ( Private lessons and ensembles too ! )

So, the question is this:

Young folks -
(PLEASE, High School age or YOUNGER only !!! )

Tell me what really interrests you in the new styles of music.
Please don't say "Rap" or "R&B" .... I don't want styles, or genres .... I want to know what todays MUSICIAN wants to learn. What chops you want. What turns you on.

Help an old dog learn some new tricks, so I can teach the young kids some of my old ones when they're not paying attention !

There is no "age barrier" in the band room..... only the sound of music.

Synth-Zone is absolutely greater than the sum of its parts ... It will rise above all the FOOLishness ...
t.

Well said Tony!

Manuel, I was just about to start a post to say the same thing after I read the last post that Nigel had to close! It is indeed sad that we need a referee, but I am glad that the last one was nipped at the bud!

If 2 or 3 people want to continue to argue why can't they handle that in private emails and quit using up Nigel's bandwith for foolishness that none of us want to see anyway.

Nigel, great job you're doing! Guys lets get back to discussing the stuff that really matters to us, music and the tools that help us make it.

Richard

I played music for over 25 years with trombone, trumpet, guitar, piano players, and drummers. Sorry but many of these folks are a different breed just like the bricklayers I've worked with also.

Now, for many of my other friends who can't lay a brick or do not know the difference between a Bb and a C, the stats are a little different. I'm not saying they are perfect. They're just not as temperamental or as easily offended as bricklayers and musicians.

The longest I worked with any band as a group in New Orleans was maybe 5 or 6 months. It's very hard keeping everyone on the same page. Too many differences of opinion, that create arguments.

Don Mason, Tom Cavanaugh, and Gary Diamond are some of the most congenial folks here on the forum. The rest of us like to argue too much. I'm a musician and a bricklayer so it's extra tough for me on the getting along part.

That's why I don't post a bunch anymore and I try to ignore many posts. The posts that bother me the most are the ones where guys record and are playing very bad chords on the old standards. Man, if you don’t know the chords, don’t record the tune and put it on the forum. There are too many professionals gathered here.

All I'm trying to say is that not all but most musicians need to learn to get a long with one another. We get along with others but don’t do very well among ourselves.

Anyone here that thinks he or she is above the rest of us need to get a Dexter Gordon, Sonny Rollins, McCoy Tyner, Wynton Kelly or some other great jazz musician's CD and really listen. If that doesn't humble you, you're hopeless.

Every time I listen to these guys I want to lay my sax in the driveway and run over it a hundred times with my truck loaded with brick.

For the past year or so, I’ve been working on trying not to say anything if I can't say something nice. It's the hardest thing I've ever worked on in my life.

I hope you guys will consider these things. When is the last time you heard DonM argue here? He just teases a little. And believe me this guy is at least 6’5” tall and goes at lease 250lbs. And boy is he mean looking! He scares me to death when I stand next to him. I say yes sir and no sir if he ask a question.
Boo

Boo, I think you contradicted yourself a couple of times. But if you re-read and don't see it, my interpretation of your points were in error and please accept my apology.

OK, I'll give you a hint...
You're afraid of 1/8 ton Don when you have a 1/2 ton, brick-loaded, sax crushing truck?



[This message has been edited by MrEd (edited 09-02-2006).]

Boo, you've been brave enough to say what a lot of us have been thinking for a long time. And it's not just the bad chords, it's the generally AWFUL playing as well.

Have you ever met someone that was really dumb but didn't realize they were dumb? What we are hearing is the musical equivalent. Since I've been on the board, I have heard two, maybe three, instances of professional-level playing (and singing). Of course, the number of self-proclaimed "professionals" far exceed that number.

In your mind, you want to be helpful and encouraging, but in your heart you want to say "sir, put up your hands and back slowly away from the keyboard". 'cause we know that all the practice in the world is no substitute for talent. You just cannot make a silk purse......... no matter what equipment you choose.

If you really love music that much, buy an iPod and become a GREAT listener or even get a nice arranger keyboard, but for heavens sake, keep it at home and (more importantly) stop posting your productions on a site populated by musicians.

The problem is, most of these so-called "professionals" are actually a lot smarter, more articulate, and have better equipment, than their real-musician counterparts. As a result, they get the lion's share of the few available gigs. This, in turn, allows them to avoid having to work a day job, thereby allowing them more time to post musical dreck (see how that works).

Has anyone ever stopped to listen to the drum parts of nearly all of the recent arranger KB offerings? That alone is enough to strip it of any musical value.

So in closing let me say, it's fine to post a tune from time to time but not until you learn to play (or at least learn the changes) and not until someone other than your immediate family tells you that you sound good (and not telling you in sign language).

chas

Oh, forgot. As to the title question.....No, not in this household, at least, not on a consistent basis.

chas

That is what I was subtlely trying to get at in this thread.
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/013932.html

But it seems as if some people think that if you are playing an arranger, displaying your arranger work has to be substandard and musically and sonically not up to par.


Then some of those people they wonder why arrangers generally do not get much respect in the keyboard world.

When you tell some arranger players any thing that is not done well on an arranger, you often hear some of them say: ------O it is just an arranger if you want better or more professional get a workstation-------.

Whether an arranger or workstation, there is no substitute for good musician skills and a good recording.