I'm one of those sad cases who can only read from the dots, can't play by ear or from memory, so you know how it is - get a burning need to play a particular tune, visit music shop, no sheet music now available, only source is from busking book which contains the one song you want plus a load of others, most of which is, to me, rubbish music or stuff you already have. An expensive way of buying, and of filling all those shelves you've labourisly put up and hoping they'll take the weight.........

BUT, Easy Recorded songs show all the chords, and it's just a question of slowing the tempo to the lowest level,40, and writing down the chord sequence, trying not to listen to the music at that speed - it sounds terrible,

So thanks to you all. I love you all

Ogre

Hi Ogre,

You a sad case? No way! You sound very apologetic because you have to play using the dots. Don't apologize! Take pride in the fact you can read music!!!! Be happy about it!!!!

I've been corresponding with a person who is debating whether to take lessons and learn to read music or let an ear-player friend teach him to play by ear (which in addition, by the way, requires ear players to memorize everything they play) and I have counseled that it is far better to learn to read music. I have in the range of 4000 - 5000 pieces of music in my music library. There is no way an ear player can memorize that many tunes. As a "reader", I can play all of them if I practice. An ear player is limited to what is contained in his/her memory. Not only that, the chords an ear player uses may not be correct harmonically speaking which tends to spoil the song he/she is trying to play. If we "readers" play a song, the harmony and melody is always correct. And what if an ear player forgets a chord or melody note? He/she has to go back to the drawing board and "hunt and peck" until the problem is fixed. We readers just pick up the music and play. The notes and chords are correct today, tomorrow, next year, and . . . well, you get the idea.

Be happy that you are a reader, that you took the time and effort to acquire that skill! Yes, it is nice to have the Easy Record music to use to find chords for songs for which you have no music, and it is wonderful that our forum friends share their music with us. But never apologize for being "just a reader". So cheer up and be happy, Ogre.

Happy Playing (and READING!)

Chuck

[This message has been edited by Chuck Piper (edited 09-08-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Chuck Piper (edited 09-08-2003).]

Hi Ogre, I have one question----

Can you hum or whistle the melody of a song?
(Without the keyboard)

John C.

Chuck,
you wrote "I have in the range of 4000 - 5000 pieces of music in my music library. There is no way an ear player can memorize that many tunes."

There are exceptions. I had a friend (back in the 60's) that played organ in a restaurant bar on weekends. He would routinely play six hours straight without music and could play properly almost anything that anyone requested. (He also would go the six hours with only one break).
He had memory and kidneys to match!
I tested him quite a few times by asking for oddball, old , or brand new songs and he always came through. I believe that he only had to hear the song once and he had it nailed. Not only the verse, but the breaks, the repeats - the whole thing.
Truly amazing.
Walt

Hi Walt,

When taking into account all of the musicians in our world, I think it is safe to say your organ playing friend had/has a remarkable and very rare talent. I have a friend in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, and he has played the piano professionally. He is solely an ear player. I also played guitar in a three-piece combo in Saudi Arabia and our keyboardist was an ear player. His repertoire of music was quite limited - maybe 50 tunes at the most. I would venture to guess 90 - 95% of musicians are readers.

I don't want to belabor the point. I am merely suggesting to Ogre that he should be glad he can read music and be proud he took the time and effort to do it. I am also suggesting that anyone wanting to learn to play a keyboard and having the option of learning to play from an ear player or engaging a teacher and learning to read would be well advised to engage a teacher and learn to read. Reading opens up the entire spectrum of music to that person.

If a person is really committed to memorizing music, it can be done. It is an acquired skill. The more you work at it the more you retain. I worked at it and found I could play about 25 tunes from memory in just a short while. I haven't taken it any further but may do so in the future. One thing I discovered and that is if I don't practice the memorized repertoire almost daily, the tunes are soon forgotten. Maybe that is unique to me - a senior becoming more senior every day. Ha!

And finally, I do thoroughly enjoy this forum and all it's members. We have a great group of people here and I am proud and honored to be a member. Nigel and Bebop have given this senior citizen a really neat home on the internet. I visit every day, several times a day. All of you take care.

Chuck

Hi Ogre
First of all pat yourself on the back for being able to read the dots.
There is plenty of software available now that can read Midi files, analyse them, change key and let you print off sheet music with chord symbols and lyrics - so you don't need to buy a 101 song book to get 1 song - just find the midi file.
If you want to try one such software package you can get a free downloadable trial version of Midi Connections Lite at http://www.bck.co.uk.
John

Thanks fellas for all your comments, particularly to Chuck for making me feel happier (not proud cos you know what comes after that) and to John for his advice.
Yes, John C I can whistle virtually any tune you can name, which brings me to the point which I suppose I was really trying to make and which I suspect may be behind your question.
Playing by ear. Now,I'll disagree with you Chuck about the limited number of tunes that some people can play by ear. I've met two or three over my life time who had the gift of being able to play any tune they were asked to. A few years back I saw a jazz pianist on TV who could do this and he was asked how he could possibly memorise all this music. He answered by saying that all he did was to remember the melody and that most people could recall any tune that they had heard (which I go along with)
and then went on to say that when he heard the melody in his head he could also hear the harmony (which I also think most of us can). But,he could also identiy the chord progression and play this on the keyboard and improvise on the melody. Now this is the gift which I wish I had, and is one which pretty well all pro players have?
How about that?!!
Ogre

Walt , are you sure your memory playing friend didn't have a hidden SD Card?... oops that was the 60's..no way to fake it back then.

Larry Hawk

Hello ogre, If you cna whistle ot hum the melody of a song, then you can play it by ear. Point; My wife started to take piano lessons at the age of five. She attended the School of Preforming Arts in N.Y.C.--The Moving picture Fame was about this school.

When she played on her Stienway Grand you sat up and listened---But---take the music away from her and she was helpless. She could not play the simplist of tunes without music.

Native ability is not the issue here. I have taught classes on,"How to play without music". The same subject was on TV some years ago, and is now again.

If I can hum/whistle the melody, I CAN FIND THESE NOTES ON MY INSTRUMENT!!
When I decided to play keyboard, I made a decision not to rely on the music as I did with my guitar studies. My wife and daughter often complained about the wrong notes I was playing. I knew that given some time my mind and my hand would get together--and they did.

1-You can fake a melody--hit a wrong note and recover quickly--and the better the pro, the quicker the recovery--but a wrong chord will be noticed easily.

2-You must study about chords and chord progressions. Most everything else will fall naturally.

I have music on my stand whenever I preform--I use it as a guide. There have been times to my surprise, that I was not even playing the song that's in front of me.

1-And yes, over the years you will change some of the original notes of the song when you play by ear--and so what. I try never to play a song note for note as it is written. I want to take liberty, it adds ME to the song. No reflections on anyone else, but I bore easily when I hear a song played note for note.

Ogre, I am now teaching 6 students ages 65 to 83 years of age. They are all learning chord construction, chord progressions, chord substutions, and HOW TO PLAY WITHOUT MUSIC! Ogre, if you have the desire, you can and will do it--When Chet Atkins a famous guitarist was asked, "Do you read music?", His answer was, "NOT ENOUGH TO HURT MY PLAYING". So very, very true.

Happy Playing, John C.

{ When Chet Atkins a famous guitarist was asked, "Do you read music?", His answer was, "NOT ENOUGH TO HURT MY PLAYING" }
I just LOVE that quotation

I don't class myself as being able to read music, however, if I wish to learn a new song/tune and the only way is 'from the dots' then I can work out the melody line slowly from the sheet music. I can read chord symbols - having learned them many years ago, playing guitar in a big band.
However, my preferred method of learning a new tune/song is to just listen to it on CD, tape, record or whatever, and work out the melody and chords with my God given ear and gut feeling. I know that I am extremely fortunate to possess this ability and that it is not something which can be easily learned - if it all.
Some of the chords I use, may not be 'as written' in the sheet music, but I find that they fit and sound OK to me. As far as the melody is concerned, I never play a tune the same way twice. I play the melody and maybe even change or substitute a chord, the way I feel it, at the time I play. It's an instantaneous creative process which I think is in-born.
Whilst not wishing to offend anyone, or belittle the ability to play from 'the dots' and I really admire those who can sight read, I feel that just playing exactly what is written on the sheet, without adding one's own 'personal touch', is a bit like putting a paper roll in a player piano.

------------------
Willum

[This message has been edited by Bill Norrie (edited 09-09-2003).]