Just getting back from 6 weeks in the Sunshine State (Florida), I expected to return to springtime up here in the north coast (northern Ohio). My computer says it's April 8, so does the newspaper and TV, but my thermometer says high of 30 and low of 20. It must be January! What's going on? I'm going back to Fla!

Glenn

I hear ya man! How can anyone deny global warming isn't right in our faces??? I live in southern West Virginia. I've been here for 10 years now. It snowed today on Easter here in WV. In the 10 years I've lived here, I've never seen it like this, and for the older residents they can't even remember when they last saw snow on Easter.

What's so bad is we had over 2 weeks of our normal temps. Just the other week it was 85 degrees. For several weeks we had all our windows open and the furnace OFF. Had to turn it back on. In southern West Virginia this weather is way out of place. Due to our normal weather temps from a few weeks ago our trees are looking more like summer now, and with the snow it's like "Christmas in July" down here.

Squeak



[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 04-08-2007).]

That's what ya get for having 6 weeks in Florida

I share your sentiments from Cincinnati.

zuki

If this global warming gets any wose, I'll freeze to death! Isn't it ironic that all this cold weather is now blamed on global warming by a handful of so called environmentalist--including Al Gore, the wannabe president.

What some folks fail to realize is the hole in the Ozone layer has nearly closed, on avage the earth's temperature has been nearly 2 degreez cooler during the past decade, the polar ice cap is slowly increasing in size and the predicted rise in ocean level has been 1/10th of an inch during the past decade. However, the politicians that have jumped on the global warming band wagon are now looking at ways to grab more of our hard earned money.

Yep, some states have recently enacted a tax on energy consumption. This is in addition to the taxes they already charge for heating oil, natural gas, etc. And, they claim the money they collect will go toward studies to curb global warming. The question that comes to mind is, how in the hell can anyone expect to solve a non-existant problem by studying it? But, you can bet your sweet ass that there will be a whole lot of PHDs jumping on the money train and every one of them will tell you just how important it is that they study this to death--just like all the other problems they've studies and never solved.

Yes, I am synical as hell about global warming and all the other BS that has come out lately from state and federal governments.

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

There are always two sides to a story, Gary. I just don't buy yours. My hat off to Al Gore.

http://www.environmentaldefense.org/page.cfm?tagID=1011

I do believe global warming is causing severe climate problems in Australia currently. Climate across the entire planet has been changing quite radically. It is an issue to consider very seriously. This isn't just some US presidential scam.

The thing is, here in the west we're being fleeced by environmental taxes (here in Alberta, since 1992, it's $4 on the price of a tire and, more recently, up to $45 on a new TV - the tire levy alone racks up $12M annually for the Alberta government) while burgeoning industrial economies like China and India, which I don't think have any controls on pollution, carry on regardless. Are there any consumer levies being paid in these countries? I highly doubt it.

It's everyone's planet, let everyone chip in.

Of course, all this will continue unabated while we still continue to troop into Wal-Mart, etc. to buy cheaply produced products made in these countries. Turns out though, these 'cheaply produced products' are costing us all dearly in the long run.

You might have just left Florida, but last night it got down to 32�F, a new record low for this time of year in Destin.

Global warming is about climate CHANGE, not just getting hotter. That can't be good (unless you already live in the Gobi Desert!)....

I'm an anti-establishment rebel, but I disagree with Gary. I don'r know where you got your information. The ozone layer is larger over Antarctica, ice caps are melting. Polar bears are losing weight.
I don't remember it being so cold in April. Last year I was cycling to work in April. This April I have my winter coat on with the hood over my head. The weather is messed up, and it is caused by global warming.

Guess you better check out the temperature on Mars too--it's warmer than it has been in 50 years. Those damned exhaust emissions! BTW: I got my information from a half-dozen interviews with climatoligist around the country as part of a newspaper article I wrote a couple years back. The scientific community does not agree with Al Gore. And, you may want to do some research of your own and check an article in last year's National Geographic Magazine that revealed the ocean level was not rising in the Gulf of Mexico as earlier reported, but instead the land was slowly sinking because of all the oil and water that was being withdrawn from beneath the ground and ocean floor. The same turns out to be the case in Florida as well where massive sink holes were created because of massive quantities of groundwater are being withdrawn by the agricultural industry for crop irrigation.

This is one of those subjects that should be aired in The Bar.

Cheers,

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

excactly

So smog, pollution, fossil fuels are all good for the planet? Clear cutting the forests and wiping out whole species of animals good for mankind?
This is one of those cases where if you look hard enough you can find enough data to confuse any opinion.
In the 50's they used to say cigarette smoking was good for you, at least not harmful, and had data to back it up for 30 years.

Global Warming is another excuse for the Goverment to TAX us more on everything they can find that they think may effect it.

IF the planet hasn't been this warm since the 1400's, what the hell did we humans do in the 1400's to cause it then? If all of civilization went back 600 years, we'd decrease total greenhouse gass on the planet by something like 4%. So is it only our 4% that is causing all the problems, or might the other 96% that has nothing to do with humans play a part? Maybe climate change is a (gasp) "NATURAL" phenominon.

"IF the planet hasn't been this warm since the 1400's, what the hell did we humans do in the 1400's to cause it then? If all of civilization went back 600 years, we'd decrease total greenhouse gass on the planet by something like 4%. So is it only our 4% that is causing all the problems, or might the other 96% that has nothing to do with humans play a part? Maybe climate change is a (gasp) "NATURAL" phenominon."

What is unprecedented is the speed of the increase in temperature. I am 45 years old, and in my very lifetime, I notice a very stark increase in temperature. The last 10 years have been the warmest on record since recording weather has begun.

I have not read any headlines about scientific articles that dispute global warming. Remember that oil companies are spending millions of dollars to create doubt about the science by paying off some scientists to dispute the current findings.

I don't think that we should experiment with our planet. When the scientists are predicting famine, crop loss, rising sea levels, mass extinctions, I think that we should be very careful about cavalier pronouncements, like "it's cold as hell here in Chicago, so there must not be global warming." Or this stuff was just is just a myth to raise taxes.

The only pertinence that this has to arranger keyboards is that it might effect my career as a musician if vast parts of Florida and other coastal waters go under water and if there are massive famines and droughts. If that stuff starts happening, then I don't think that there will be much a budget for what I do.

Beakybird

By the way, I would like to find out the name of the scientists who dispute the science behind global warming, and the name and date of just one of the peer reviewed scientific journals where any of their findings can be found.

Then lets get back to talking about keyboards.

Beakybird

[This message has been edited by Beakybird (edited 04-09-2007).]

You guys are spelling it wrong:
Glo-bull..warming...phht let me at the cavemen who created the Ice-age i tells ya!

So if we were heading for another ice age, would it be wise for us then to drive larger SUV's, burn more oil? No, we would be to blame for that somehow too. No doubt in my mind about that.

People are getting confused man. Global warming has an impact on the climate. Not just warmer weather, but screws it up completely. My family who lives in Erie can speak to that. Eries known for cold and snowy winters. The winters have become milder over the years up there. Shit we're seeing snow in WV in the first weeks of April. That's not normal.

We're without a doubt going through climate changes, and all the crap we're putting into the air isn't helping a bit. Also taking away natural resources can't be good either. Look at all the coal mining in West Virginia. Our own powerplants burn a crap load of coal everyday. It's gonna run out eventually. There's gonna be long term effects.

Also keep in mind that it HAS been proven that the big oil companies have "paid" scientists to rebut global warming for their own greedy reasons. The shit's gonna hit the fan one day. I won't be here to get sprayed by it, but I'm sure my daughters children are going to be seeing the effects.

Squeak

You all might read the article below. This is about what can really happen now. And there's nothing you can do about it...
http://www.alternet.org/story/17711/

1. All but one of the oil and gas companies are pumping a lot of money into Renewable Energy, so as to make sure that their shareholders can still make shed loads of money when Fossil Fuels run out. (So that is one conspiracy theory blown out the window)
2. If life had never evolved on this planet, the climate would be changing exactly the same as it is today.
3. Start adapting to Climate Change, as there is nothing that anyone on this planet can do about it.
Enjoy

Bill

The film The Day After Tomorrow was based on this possibility, and if it does occur (Has as happened many times before in Earths History) all the scientists now agree that it will not occur quite as quickly as first thought, so there will be ample time to move people closer to the equator and restructure the economies.
Enjoy life

Bill

Here is an interesting link.. http://www.iceagenow.com/

Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children.
~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

When all the trees have been cut down, when all the animals have been hunted, when all the waters are polluted, when all the air is unsafe to breathe, only then will you discover you cannot eat money.
~ Cree Prophecy

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
� We are a part of the earth and it is part of us
~ Chief Seattle

When we show our respect for other living things, they respond with respect for us.
~ Arapaho Proverb

We must protect the forests for our children, grandchildren and children yet to be born. We must protect the forests for those who can't speak for themselves such as the birds, animals, fish and trees.
~ Qwatsinas, Nuxalk Nation

I am tired of talk that comes to nothing. It makes my heart sick when I remember all the good words and all the broken promises. There has been too much talking by men who had no right to talk.
� It does not require many words to speak the truth.
~ Chief Joseph: Nez Perce 1840-1904, Nez Perc�� Indian chief

In my native homeland (the badlands of south west Texas) I have noticed that Mother Nature really does not have the patiance (or comodities) to stand for insubordination.
It's said that the world is ~2B people heavy... I don't see any one volinteering... The world has always righted itself, and will continue to do so. We know of at least 6 ages before we came along, and there is every chance that there will be at least that many more. No use in gettin all upset. Just enjoy what you can, while you can, after all 10 out of 10 die.

I saw George Carlin in Las Vegas some years ago. He did a great sketch about the state of the world .... "The planet isn't in trouble, it's us that is in trouble. The planet will be here long after we have gone"

And right he is!

Ordnung muss sein!

I have noted that when a problem arises a technology comes along that fixes the problem.
For instance it was predicted in the horse drawn days that if the horse population kept increasingf in London horse manure would get to three feet high in the streets.
It didn't happen because the motor vehicle came along.
All we get these days is doom and gloom.
Things will fall from the sky.
The sea level will rise.
It has all happened before.
The end will come when the Lord is good and ready.

What we need is a little faith.

Cousin Ken

You could be right, so let's not tick him off by not keeping our "room" clean.

chas

@ Chas....just couldn't resist...

Take out the papers and the trash
Or you don't get no spendin' cash
If you don't scrub that kitchen floor
You ain't gonna rock and roll no more
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

Just finish cleanin' up your room
And sweep the dust out with that broom
Get all that garbage out of sight
Or you don't go out Friday night
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

You just put on your coat and hat
And walk yourself to the laundromat
And when you finish doin' that
Bring in the dog and put out the cat
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

Don't you give me no dirty looks
Your father's hip; he knows what cooks
Just tell your hoodlum friend outside
You ain't got time to take a ride
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

(Repeat and fade
Yakety yak, yakety yak

I certainly don't know "real" facts, or what's gonna happen, but I don't believe anybody does... not really. All of a sudden everyone thinks the sky is gonna fall because of global warming. In the 70s, which is not that long ago, people thought the sky would fall because of global cooling!

I feel better knowing George Carlin says we'll be alright.

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Larry
SynthZone Frapper

I do agree that our climate is changing. I've lived in Western Michigan all my life and the winters are much milder than they were 50 years ago.

Where I disagree is it is not proven that we humans are causing the change in the climate. I've heard that we are responsible for 3 to 4 percent of the greenhouse gasses. Our impact is actually very very small.

Should we drive fuel efficient and non polluting cars? Of course. Should we not devastate the rain forest and chop down trees for more malls and parking lots? Of course. Will these measures correct or change our climate? That is not proven.

Al Gore (like all political hacks) needs a soapbox on which to speak. The theory and solutions he proposes, he proposes for everyone while exempting himself. Where are the scientists and their predictions if we all walk to work and go to bed at sunset? If we reduce our greenhouse gasses by 50 percent what are they and Al Gore predicting the impact will be on the climate. The silence is deafening.

Remember, if a politician's lips are moving, he is probably not telling the truth.

Tom

Why would they make it up?

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Larry
SynthZone Frapper

Two words, lahawk . . . political gain.

That's really all any politician is interested in. Oh, and re-election.

Maybe watching "Thank You For Smoking" will help shed some light on how politicians and multi-nationals deal with issues.

Political Gain?

All of these 1000's of scientists from around the world are running for office?



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Larry
SynthZone Frapper

It's not that I doubt the scientists themselves, though there are plenty of other scientists who'll support the opposing view. My gripe is with the politicos who'll kick this particular political football about till we're all thoroughly sick and tired of it (aren't many of us already there?), and go broke shoring up their rhetoric via ever-increaing taxes, levies, etc., while the plebs of this planet eventually wither away through apathy.