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#506166 - 07/12/22 01:29 PM Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard?
travlin'easy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 15367
Loc: Forest Hill, MD USA
The king of purchasing new keyboards within a day after they hit the market, was beyond any reasonable doubt, Donny Pesce (DNJ). Donny went through arranger keyboards faster than anyone I ever met. He is a very good player/musician and onstage entertainer. I have seen him perform, in person, on several occasions and he can keep a dance floor packed to capacity.

That said, we spent lots of time on the telephone together, going through the technical aspects of each keyboard he purchased, Yamaha, Korg, Roland, etc... and develop ways to use them effectively on stage. Even after mastering his new keyboard to a major degree, within weeks, and sometime within hours, he would send it back and go back to one of his older keyboards. Why did he do this?

The answer is quite simple - GAS (gear acquisition syndrome), which effects a large number of forum members. For me, Diki, Fran, and a few others, we tend to hang onto our aging keyboards until they begin to develop a fungal growth on the PC boards. wink Well, maybe not that long, but usually, a decade or more.

The reasoning behind this is we, as onstage entertainer/musicians, have mastered the operating system in such a way that we can transition from song to song in a matter of just one or two seconds. We tend to plan things well ahead and program our arranger keyboards to make this all possible with the least possibility of a hiccup.

Home players, on the other hand, do not have to worry about the problems of being on stage in front of an audience. They can take their time arranging and recording songs using a variety of onboard and external software and recording devices, then post their works on various forums of their choice.

Some claim they purchase a new arranger keyboard for the new styles. Ironically, those new styles will quickly be available for upload within a matter of weeks, converted to a format that makes them playable in your old keyboard. Granted, this is not always the case, but for the most part, it seems to be a valid point.

Others say they bought a new board because the voices are more realistic. The voices in your ancient keyboard are usually editable and for the most part, you can make them as realistic as you wish with very little effort using onboard software.

For me, I'll stick with my aging S-950, which has undergone a few button replacements, but for the most part, it has served me well for more than 2 decades.

So, why do you need a NEW arranger keyboard?

All the best,

Gary cool
_________________________
PSR-S950, TC Helicon Harmony-M, Digitech VR, Samson Q7, Sennheiser E855, Custom Console, and lots of other silly stuff!

K+E=W (Knowledge Plus Experience = Wisdom.)

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#506168 - 07/12/22 02:37 PM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
Bernie9 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/02
Posts: 5420
Loc: Port Charlotte,FL,USA
I have seen reports that the old psr 3000 was fundamentally better than the 950, minus the OS enhancements. I favored the sound of my s910 after I bought my s950. The problem is that you seem to give up something to gain the goodies in the new. I have GAS (both kinds) for years. I am more of a scatter gun player, using whatever tool I have in my arsenal to get the tunes out there in a respectable manner. I have thousands of songs on my six keyboards that affords me all of the variety I could ever need.

The keep and "make it your own" approach has much merit with musicians that have a technical bent and/or that are determined to perfect their registrations and learn the deeper functions.

Donny has been a great performer for a long time. He knows what he wants, but has had to go through more keyboards than I even, to get there. I think we both are similar in the respect that I am willing to spend just so much time to see if a board is a suitable partner for me. Most likely it is not the arrangers fault, but it has to fit in with my way of doing things, or the time expenditure is not worth it.

Considering the amount of time we spend with our music, who can say anybody is wrong.
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pa4X 76 ,SX900, Audya 76,Yamaha S970 , vArranger, Hammond SK1, Ketron SD40, Centerpoint Space Station, Bose compact

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#506169 - 07/12/22 02:44 PM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
Gunnar Jonny Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/01/01
Posts: 4266
Loc: Norway
Quote Gary:
"So, why do you need a NEW arranger keyboard?"

I really don't need to buy new ones, what I already have and had goes way beyond my skills.
I'm just buying out of excitement and curiosity and that I like to try to learn new things in the arranger world.
It's a hobby, expensive but fun, and I feel it give me challenges and keep me younger in mind and soul.
Probably just an imagination, but anyway .... grin grin grin
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Cheers šŸ„‚
GJ
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"Success is not counted by how high you have climbed
but by how many you brought with you." (Wil Rose)

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#506172 - 07/12/22 05:24 PM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
montunoman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 3113
Loc: Dallas, Texas
Upgrading from the Yamaha S950 to the SX 900 was totally worth it for the looping function. Total game changer !
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It not the keyboard, it's the keyboardist.

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#506175 - 07/13/22 07:47 AM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
W Tracy Parnell Offline
Member

Registered: 08/22/06
Posts: 746
Loc: NY
The answer is-most people don't need a new one. But if you have the money and you want to buy a new keyboard as a sort of motivational technique, that is ok. Donny-now that is a whole different discussion! smile
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Komplete Kontrol S61/Korg PA900/JBL 308P/Focusrite Clarett 2Pre/Band in a Box/Reaper/EZdrummer 2

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#506176 - 07/13/22 08:39 AM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
TedS Offline
Member

Registered: 04/28/06
Posts: 758
Loc: North Texas, USA
I owned a PSR-3000 for a while. Yamaha made some subtle, undocumented revisions to their chord recognition logic sometime before the introduction of the PSR-S910, which made it easier to play Maj7 chords on the newer models. By "easier," I mean that the revised programming allowed you to play these chords by pressing fewer keys, and they were recognized in more inversions, which translates to less hand movement.

I know you're all going to jump on me now, and say "Just practice more." "You really should be pressing all four notes for a major seventh," etc. But a programming change like this instantly allowed me to play some songs that had difficult progressions a tempo without making the usual mistakes. So for me, the programming changes justified upgrading to the newer model. Yes, the PSR-3000 had better build quality.

Yamaha also made a couple of subtle changes to its "AI Fingered" system, since that system was introduced on the original Tyros circa 2000. I believe those changes affected the repertoire of "rootless" chords. Not something I use, but I remember a few here on the forum were disappointed when they discovered this.

Yamaha doesn't document these types of changes in detail because, well, they're never wrong. They don't make mistakes, so they don't have to correct them! :-) But if they added a setting to the Genos, etc., that allowed a single note to be recognized as a MAJOR chord, instead of a unison (what were they thinking!?) then my check would be in the mail!

As an aside, I actually created a custom style for my Tyros 5, using a third-party utility to edit hidden parameters in the CASM. In the AI Fingered mode, any time you play a single note, a Unison [1+8] is recognized. However, for this chord type, I programmed my style to sound the "missing" third and fifth on unused channel tracks. So what you hear is a major chord! What did I name this special style? "Down with the Unison!"



Edited by TedS (07/13/22 05:03 PM)

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#506177 - 07/13/22 09:00 AM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
Impuls Offline
Member

Registered: 02/24/02
Posts: 611
Loc: Netherlands
Nobody needs a new keyboard or a car or a new kitchen etc etc , but if you can afford it , its a lot of fun
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Genos,Nord Electro 5D YT : https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmC6hdAR1v5lYN8twfn0YbA

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#506178 - 07/13/22 09:51 AM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
Kabinopus Offline
Member

Registered: 11/11/04
Posts: 665
Loc: Russia
Gary, your writing is always vivid and easy to read :-)

TedS, if we all played music same way, we would produceĀ same music :-) but everyone has his own approach and yours is rather sophisticated (programming scares me).Ā 

My SX900 is in a service now, 30 miles away from me, they say they fixed the noise, I'm not very optimistic, but hope to get it back soon. 4 days without it made me realize that I actually needed it. Recently I tried a jazz style, just drums, and it sounded so realistic... And DX pianos; never really enjoyed them on previous keyboards, but now they are my favorite. There are a lot of essential improvements about how is sounds in general: strings, organs, guitars...

In the same time, it's not quite the same as being inspired. I composed most of my songs on PSR-3000, less on S950, and even less on SX900.

On one hand, I would like to have Genos in my room, maybe that would be productive. On the other hand, I understand that inspiration might come not because of new equipment, but because of events in our lives, people we meet, or when we are welcome with our music in some place. And a $5000 bulky keyboard in not exactly the best companion when it comes to playing in public, especially in places where people hardly make $500 in a month, but that's a different story.

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#506179 - 07/13/22 09:58 AM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
travlin'easy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 15367
Loc: Forest Hill, MD USA
I could buy a dozen new arranger keyboards for what my wife wants to spend on the new kitchen. And, she hates to cook! I do all the cooking here. smile

As for an expensive hobby, well, arranger keyboards are dirt cheap when compared to recreational boating. Even sailing. First, you need to buy the boat, then add all the goodies, electronics, galley, bedding, safety equipment, etc... So there goes a quick $100,000 for a good, used, sailboat or powerboat, in the 33 to 40 foot range.

Next, you add the cost of storage at the local marina. The boat is too big to trailer, therefore, slip rent ranging from $3,000 to $5,000 for the season must be taken into consideration, plus winter storage costs, which range from $900 to $1,500 to put the boat on dry land for the winter.

Now, that's an expensive hobby - I should know!

All the best,

Gary cool
_________________________
PSR-S950, TC Helicon Harmony-M, Digitech VR, Samson Q7, Sennheiser E855, Custom Console, and lots of other silly stuff!

K+E=W (Knowledge Plus Experience = Wisdom.)

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#506180 - 07/13/22 11:53 AM Re: Why do you need to buy a NEW arranger keyboard? [Re: travlin'easy]
Kabinopus Offline
Member

Registered: 11/11/04
Posts: 665
Loc: Russia
Yes, that's a lot to think about. I realize I shouldn't complaint about how expensive keyboards are, after all, this is a kind of things which are reachable, even if it requires an extra effort. Also, the mind always plays tricks; once your "dream" is at your disposal, it's no longer a dream, just a reality, with all its natural flaws.


Edited by Kabinopus (07/13/22 12:03 PM)

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