I have two events coming up that my Ketron SD40, controller kb, mic, and Bose compact will do nicely. I am not sure if a mixer would would give me more headroom, if needed. I normally run the module at 1:00 and Bose at 12:00. These are restaurants with about 50 guests.

you should not need a mixer. you have plenty of headroom for you people.
MEL

I think if you have enough inputs on the Bose , then no. I don't know the controls on the Bose but if it has a Master Volume run it wide open and adjust from the channel controls or your keyboard. Don't limit the amps headroom.

Another opinion:
Not all rooms are the same.


1-The Mic. import in the Bose sounds for good voice.
2-The second does not give you control of bass and treble.

Using a mixer:
One channel for voice and one for the keyboard.
1-Voice channel --- you control Bass, treble, some have mid-range, volume, and reverb. Bose also has Bass and treble for the voice, but the mixer is in reach.
2-Instrument channel --- Has Bass and treble.
Voice channel Pan to the left Instrument channel to the right.
Now you are prepared for whatever. I bought a small quality mixer.
Why not?
John C.
[u][/u]

don't forget, the bose does not have effects for mic or insturment inputs.
MEL

Thanks guys, but the SD40 can easily handle effects and eq incl mic. The only question I have is volume on SD40 and/or Bose. Bill, are you saying to increase the Bose volume first, rather than the SD40?

The reason I ask is that on my Spacestation, it say keyboard first and amp last. I have no idea, just asking.

Thank you Bill. I tried your suggestion, and as you say, I have plenty of headroom. and great response with no distortion at all.

Bernie

Bernie, I have not used a mixer for the last 20 years I was working, regardless of the size of the venue - it just was unnecessary. I fire my headset mic through the keyboard and used all the tools on the keyboard for effects, EQ, mic, etc... Just one more thing an OMB entertainer doesn't need. As for headroom, I rarely turned my L1 Compact above the 1-O'clock position with audiences of 80 to 100 ppl, even in a large venue. Keep in mind that unlike traditional PA systems, the falloff with the Bose L1 Compact at 50 feet is less than 10 percent, where a conventional sound system usually experiences a falloff of nearly 50 percent at 50 feet. And, of course, the Bose L1 and L1 Compact eliminated the need for an external monitor as well. Sure made my life a lot easier, especially when you are doing lots of doubles and a few triples every day of the week.

Good luck,

Gary

I have gone direct line outs into my K10’s for a few years now. Works like a charm…

But I do carry a little mini mixer (Yamaha MG06X) in my cable case, just in case I either have someone want to sit in, or the venue wants a feed for the house, or I need something to convert to mic level from line level (which saves me from carrying a DI box as well). It’s a very versatile mixer, and allowed me to have a three piece with no extra gear (two other singers, one who played guitar).

The only issue with needing a mixer for some people is if a) your keyboard doesn’t have a mic in with EQ and effects, and b) if your PA only has XLR inputs and your keyboard only has line level 1/4” outputs and you don’t have a D/I box.

Keyboards have a fairly hot line level output, so the odds of you running into a PA that your keyboard’s volume knob was incapable of getting to full power (before distortion!) are slim to none…

So, bottom line, you don’t NEED a mixer if your keyboard has a versatile mic in. But it is handy to have a small one like mine as an audio toolbox just in case! 🎹😎

Glad you like it Bernie. No sense limiting your amps power. High end pro amps don't use their volume controls for balance, just to bring the power up slowly when first turned on.

I received word from the first event that a mic is needed for announcements, as well as mine. My choices seem to be to use my Yamaha MGO6X with two mics, or simply run the second one from my Bose jack without effects, using my in-line volume control. The mixer seems to be the best option, after all, in this situation. It is still easier than bringing a gun to a knife fight with the PA4X.

Bernie, when I was working and someone needed a mic for announcements, I merely plugged my old Samson Q7 directly into the Bose mic input, no effects. Worked like a charm.

Good luck,

Gary

Yeah, on the whole, announcement mics should have no effects at all, even compression (or it will tend to feed back more than an uncompressed mic).

The only problem putting an announcement mic direct into a sub and stick PA is being able to quickly adjust the gain or turn it off if it starts to squeal. It’s not often easy to bend down and adjust on the sub if it’s behind you or anywhere out of reach. I would recommend the little mixer just for the announcement mic (if you normally run your vocal mic into your keyboard). Plus, you can get away with a cheaper mic (can’t tell you how often I’ve seen an announcement mic dropped or banged about!) if you have an EQ on the mixer.

As you can see in my setup video on You Tube, my L1 Compact was positioned within easy reach of my stool. If you failed to turn down the volume on the announcement mic, even the Samson Q7, which was very resistant to feedback, there seemed to be a looping problem when you resumed playing and singing through the keyboard. It only took me a few seconds to figure this out.

Good luck,

Gary

I am glad to hear it, as I have never used the direct input. As far a volume control is concerned, as I mentioned, I have a volume attenuator that works well, and fits onto the mic before the cable.

http://www.blowsmeaway.com/xlr.html

Genos has a built in mixer…most arrangers do…right?

I probably missed something as I didn’t read the entire thread.

😊

Yes, all arrangers have built in mixers of sorts, but I was wondering about total headroom with, and without an external mixer. The consensus is to increase the volume on my Bose, then adjust with keyboard controls.

Bernie, the keyboard provides sufficient output to power your Bose L1 Compact without distortion. I rarely turned my PSR-S050 master volume above the 1-O'clock position, and rarely turned the L1 Compact above the 12-O'clock position for venues with 80 to 100 ppl in the room, even those with high ceilings and lots of sound absorbing material on the walls. Unfortunately, I no longer travel to your part of the world, or I would be able to demonstrate this in person for you. Eddie Shoemaker lives in Stuart, which is all the way on the other coast from you, but I'm sure he could help you set everything up as well.

I think you are worrying about a problem that really does not exist.

Good luck,

Gary

You might want to check your manual for what is the “unity gain“ setting of the PA inputs. Basically, what this does is set your PA up so that it isn’t attenuating your input signal, nor is it boosting it which may introduce some additional noise.

Now try adjusting the volume with the keyboard’s outputs and see if that gives you sufficient volume for the venue. This should, in theory, give you the best signal to noise ratio for your system overall. There is nothing to gain by putting a super hot signal in and turning it down, but there is plenty to lose by putting a too quiet signal in, and then boosting it with additional amplification. Essentially, you are shooting for the PA to work at its optimal level, which is usually the unity gain point.

Generally, most arrangers do not introduce additional noise unless it is in the last 10% of the volume knobs travel. I’d generally tend to not try to push the keyboard past the 75% to 80% volume points. But at unity gain in most PAs other than really, really small ones, this is MORE than sufficient for most gigs.

Thank you for the additional information. My questions were very well answered. My last post was in response to Guitpic 1 question. I am good to go.