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#268918 - 08/15/09 06:05 PM
Re: Good news from Roland?
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 2580
Loc: Ocala, FL USA
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Heres the story on the fills (we have gone over it before).
1) Yes a PA800/PA2XPRO (right out of the box) on some styles (Definetly only some styles...I think ones with guitar tracks in them) if the fill is pressed just anytime will sometimes immediately upon entry trigger a sound that does not seem to fit at that specific time. It can makes things sound a little OFF. This is because it triggers IMMEDIATELY and triggers at that point in the fill (that point in the pattern sequence), not the beginning of the fill. So, depending on the style..and what is at that spot in the fill...it is a problem. Once again only on some styles.
2) If prssed on the downbeat (red indicator on) it never has any issues because the fill starts at the beginning the way it was programmed and sounds fine. Seems to work fine for any variation also.
3) In Release 2.0 of PA800/Pa2XPRO (released this spring) Korg enhanced a programming parameter in style record mode(modify a style or make your own) called 'CUE MODE'. With that Parm, we can now EASILY change a style fill or a variation for that matter to begin on 'Next measure, first measure' = The style element enters at the beginning of the next measure, and begins from the first measure of the new pattern. This is for variations and fills. So if you make this change...when you press a fill it does not start in the middle of its pattern (and play any sound that may not sound quite ok based on the timing of when you press the fill. I have changed a few styles that I use and it made a big improvement.
4) The trasitions from one variation to another is fine and you don't need a fill neccessarily. Sometimes I use one, sometimes not.
5) The CUE mode has 4 otions in it: Immediate first measure (only for fills), Immediate next measure (Only for fills) Next measure first measure (Fills & Vars), Mext measure current measure (Only on Vars) So, per style, per style element you can setup whatever you want. This is a PRO workstation, hence, yes, there is LOTS of programming options. I like that.
Comment...Personally I think this area of the board could be a little better right out of the box (and more fills would be nice as well) ...but, with everything it offers I do not find it to be a big deal for me. For me (you may not see it this way) it is not a reason to not get one or change to anything else currently out there.
Lee S.
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Lee S.
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#268919 - 08/15/09 07:05 PM
Re: Good news from Roland?
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Member
Registered: 10/22/03
Posts: 1155
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Originally posted by Diki: The trouble with this analogy is that it fails to explain why the TOTL arrangers have just seen something like a 25-30% increase in price (T2 used to be roughly $3500 street price, now it's supposedly pushing $4500), similar with Ketron, yet the MOTL hasn't seen this jump. The S950 is going to be only $200 or so more than the S900.
Now, given that both of these model jumps only represent a minor upgrade in technology, why the 30% for the TOTL and only 10% for the MOTL? One would have thought, IF having your customers over a barrel explained this, the MOTL could be as severely inflated.
Personally, I think it comes about because Yamaha are perhaps realizing the light at the end of the tunnel is the train coming the other way! As arrangers become less and less relevant to today's musician, at least for the TOTL, they are prepared to trade volume for profit. Sell 30% fewer arrangers at 30% more, you come out about the same. The only problem with this is that it is a death spiral. Anyone that watched the rapid increase in home organs' prices in the seventies and eighties as the market dwindled can't help but recognize the same trend here.
Yamaha's market research quite possibly point out to them that, at the MOTL price point, a 30% price increase will result in a greater than 30% drop in sales, as budget arranger users are on a MUCH tighter budget, but, at the TOTL, the sky's the limit. It appears they have heard of the saying "A fool and his (retirement) money are soon parted"...
The puzzling thing is, haven't Yamaha owners noticed, it only takes a while (six months to a year) before quality conversions of newer styles from the latest model become ported over for the older model..? If new styles truly ARE the reason T2 players upgrade, why don't they just wait? In fact, I believe that many ARE waiting... I certainly haven't seen all that many posts by T2 owners posting that they absolutely HAD to have the T3. At least, those competent enough to already play well and gig steady.
The 'home' user, though... he's ripe for the fleecing. If you can't PLAY any better, there's only one way you can convince yourself you are getting better, isn't there?
Thank God, at least the MOTL players recognize that price SHOULD reflect capability
[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 08-15-2009).]Yamaha as does other arranger manufacturers realize that the MOTL players are gigging musicians and are the same market like the TOTL WS user. So price is a factor at that stage. If a person is considering a MOTL arranger, they are looking at price vs features. Now, given that MOTL arrangers today have probably the same or better quality and features than yesterday’s TOTL arrangers, a skillful gigging arranger player is perhaps the major market for the MOTL arranger because they don't have to have everything done for them and are willing to edit to make the arranger sound to their liking. Just look at how many persons gig with an S900 or a PA 800. The MS is even going to have MOTL arrangers. And, I believe that if Roland stays in the arranger business, it will be a MOTL. You see, before, the gigging musician, in order to get the better sounds and styles, they had to buy the TOTL. Today, now that the MOTL arranger has comparable sounds and styles to yesterday's TOTL, the gigging arranger player does not have to buy a TOTL. So, the pool of persons left who would buy a TOTL arranger has dwindled and only people who would buy an arranger where price is not an option is left. That is why arranger manufacturers can up the price on the TOTL. But, as you said, that will not last for ever. [This message has been edited by to the genesys (edited 08-15-2009).]
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TTG
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