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#240679 - 08/24/08 11:53 AM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
squeak_D Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4643
Loc: West Virginia
Ian.., your problem is you've been in bed with Yamaha too long. Myself..., and those here on the Zone who know me... know well that I am not a ONE brand guy. I do like Yamaha, but NEVER in a million years would I buy one of Yamaha's top arrangers (especially when I can get one of their pro synths for much less and one built 10 times better). If I didn't like Yamaha I wouldn't have a Yamaha Motif ES6... Sure I've owned their lower end stuff, but for the price they ask on the high end arrangers and how they're built.., there's absolutely NO WAY.

AND DIKI IS DEAD ON RIGHT ABOUT SOMETHING... All the bitchin about the G-70's weight.., when there's a baby G-70 called the E-60. 76 good keys, good styles, good sounds, and did I mention 76 FREAKIN keys.... with built in speakers and all that coming in at like 28lbs....

Fran on your topic... Kudo's for exploring the G's synth capabilities. I've said for years on this forum that (from what I've seen over the years about presets) that if some of the arranger owners here took the time to look.., they'd realize that the tools to make their sounds better are onboard. Complaints about this piano too bright, this one too dark, blah blah.., when the solution is a simple filter adustment (and not using an insert EQ effect). I'm glad you're enjoying the synth power of your G. Keep twistin up those sounds..., as it's a lot of fun. I still say however.., that it would be nice to find dedicated real-time control of synth parameters on the panel of pro arrangers. Could you imagine the modern music you could make if your arranger had a rotary knob that let you do filter sweeps in real-time! Slider just don't cut it IMO..., ya need to grab a knob.

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 08-24-2008).]
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.

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#240680 - 08/24/08 11:59 AM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10592
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by squeak_D:
Ian.., your problem is you've been in bed with Yamaha too long.


No,Squeak...I don't have a problem.

I just happen to love the product.

That's why I sleep where I do.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#240681 - 08/24/08 12:06 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Quote:
Originally posted by squeak_D:
Slider just don't cut it IMO..., ya need to grab a knob.


There's quite a few fans of the ARP's that might disagree, there, squeak. Plus all the Roland Jupiter's, Juno 106's, Kurzweil K2500's etc., etc..

It's not so much HOW you adjust a parameter, it's that the parameter HAS a controller, no matter what kind it is

But preset styles, preset sounds, preset songs... That's what drives the arranger industry. Sad, ain't it?

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#240682 - 08/24/08 12:15 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
squeak_D Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4643
Loc: West Virginia
Yeah.., too much preset.., and not enough YOUsets I guess that's a fine line between arranger players and WS players. It seems the average arranger want's that out of box preset, and the WS players want the ability to take that same preset and make it a YOUSet.

Sliders and knobs are a matter of personal taste I guess. I like sliders, but for some things I prefer the knobs.
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.

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#240683 - 08/24/08 12:16 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10592
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
I prefer sliders...

Slider positions are easier to read at a glance, and sliders have the advantage of letting the player move more than one at a time.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#240684 - 08/24/08 12:22 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
Burkels Offline
Member

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 319
Loc: Alkmaar, The Netherlands, Euro...
Quote:
Sliders and knobs are a matter of personal taste I guess. I like sliders, but for some things I prefer the knobs.


Personally, I'm VERY pleased with the 9 sliders under the display of my new E-80. Especially for adjusting volume-levels "on the fly" while playing along with a song or style. Great!


------------------
- THE DUTCH KEYBOARD FORUM
http://www.keyboardforum.nl
_________________________
- THE DUTCH KEYBOARD FORUM
http://www.keyboardforum.nl
Happy owner of a Roland E-80 V2

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#240685 - 08/24/08 12:23 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
True that, Ian!

squeak, you'd be amazed at the number of WS players I've seen that barely touch the presets, either!

I think it is far more to do with the player than the capability of the keyboard itself. Most arrangers have reasonably powerful voice editing if you WANT to use it.

Finding that desire is the trick...

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#240686 - 08/24/08 12:28 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 5645
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Dnj:
Although I dont.......many professionals use the ONE FINGER MODE.......

Is it looked down upon?


It is by me.......except that I would never classify that individual a professional in the first place.

chas
_________________________
"Faith means not wanting to know what is true." [Nietzsche]

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#240687 - 08/24/08 01:02 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 5645
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Fran Carango:
Now the surprise....although the edit tools are slightly different to what I am use too..with workstations....The G70 is really deep with sound design..



I'm suprised too, Fran. Most true geeks wouldn't have a keyboard five minutes, much less 16 months, before getting under the hood to "see what she'll do". So what were you too busy collecting SMF's? Glad you were able to shed some light on that one-finger-chord thing, though. It's good to be an expert in at least one area.

On the whole busines of sound design, there seems to be a divergence between the super techy and the super player. There are always exceptions, of course (Wendy Carlos), but in my experience, their interests and goals are usually completely different. There is the supergeek/tweaker who is always looking for the 'perfect' piano but when they finally find it, it rarely inspires them to produce a great piece of music with it. Just getting the sound is what turns them on.

There are so many variables in every thing related to music that it's impossible to say ANYTHING with any certainty. That's why all opinions are equally valid (except mine, which is usually somewhat superior).

chas
_________________________
"Faith means not wanting to know what is true." [Nietzsche]

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#240688 - 08/24/08 02:42 PM Re: Surprise, Surprise, Surprise....
Dnj Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 39522
Loc: NJ
Quote:
Originally posted by cgiles:
It is by me.......except that I would never classify that individual a professional in the first place.

chas


I know many Keyboard arranger players that use the one finger chord option & sound great because they have a strong right hand & super vocals, but are weak in the left hand chord dept... its just another playing technique that is offered on the unit, so who is to say whats good & bad if its acually there to be used by the player just like any other of the features to make music.....I used fingered, the next guy full keyboard mode...who cares.....it's what the music produced sounds like that is what I'm concerned with always when I hear it.

I also agree with you Chas on many things you said in the other post regarding "Super Geek Tweakers" who don't play well but are always in search of the "perfect sound".....good post which makes alot of sense..

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