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#123066 - 01/06/02 02:30 AM Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
john smies Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/05/00
Posts: 1384
Loc: koudekerke, Holland.
Check out this song recorded by Fabio (from Belgium) who runs his own Korg PA-80 site, (one of the best take it from me !!)
I have been given to understand that Fabio recorded this song with the sole use of the PA-80, however, and this is the interesting point, importing drum samples from the Triton!
Furthermore he recorded the singing with the aid of the vocaliser.
To my mind this recording illustrates what I often say about 'keyboards sounding like keyboards' and 'keyboards sounding like real bands'. Check out the drummer on this song,
can you believe we are listening to a keyboard ??????!!!!
The song is called "dis moi comment" ("tell me how" and can be downloaded from :
www.arrangerkeyboard.com

(thank you Charlie for including it).

regards
john.

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#123067 - 01/06/02 06:28 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Very Nice Song/Arrangement. I wish KORG would make the PA80 Navagationaly friendly in the future models especially for the pro. That in my opinion was the thing that turned me off when I played one. It had Great Sounds.

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#123068 - 01/06/02 07:17 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Okay John,
we 've heard the keyboard sounding like a keyboard.....now, where is the keyboard sounding like a real band?
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Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#123069 - 01/06/02 08:19 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
Fabio,
Nice work - nice sounds.
As to the drums, they DO sound very good, but they are so far out in the mix, that they seem like the feature sound, and makes everything else but the vocal sound muffled. This, in effect makes them sound artificial because of the "sameness" and constant presence in the forefront.
I'm trying not to sound negative - I like the song, really! I sometimes have the same problem with my rhodes and piano sounds - I like to hear them so much that I often have them a little too loud as well.
Sometimes the tone of a "favorite" sound can overide the place in the mix, and that's what I hear in this tune. I'd try to back the drums off a little and brighten up the rest of the song. Maybe that's an American taste, I don't know. I really don't mean to offend - I like the tune, I do.
Keep up the good work, and thanx for giving us the oportunity to share the piece.
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#123070 - 01/06/02 09:19 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
john smies Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/05/00
Posts: 1384
Loc: koudekerke, Holland.
UNCLE DAVE,

Unfortunately Fabio has very little command of English so on his behalf I would like to clarify that the purpose of this song was to illustrate the NEW and POWERFUL feature of importing external samples into the PA-80.
Having imported drum samples from the Triton
the drumsound has been given the stage so to speak; it will be obvious to most that it is too much up front for a "normal" mix. My fault for not making this clear.

DREAMER:

To me this sounds like a real band, but I am sure you will debate that the Roland is much more true to life. Ognuno il suo........!!
I beg to differ .

john.

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#123071 - 01/06/02 10:08 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
John,
first of all, let me congratulate with you for your italian; I am sure that you have spent more than a few days in my country. Then let me say that I really liked Fabio's songs (by the way, he has an italian name and that's a big plus, to my eyes...). The drums are really good and reminded me those I heard in the SD1 demo CD (the track was aptly called "Acoustic drummer"), and also the Roland V-drums (and that's a big compliment, for sure!)
When I bought the VA 7 I gave the PA 80 a good try, but at the end went for Roland, because the dealer offered me a great price (almost the same as the PA 80...) and because I liked the Roland sounds more (and I am not talking just of drums...)
I agree that Roland, Korg and Ketron have the best drums among all the arrangers; sometimes it's really hard to tell the difference...
Con amicizia,
Andrea
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Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#123072 - 01/06/02 11:55 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
I wonder exactly what it is that makes some companies' drums sound more realistic or "live" than others? Is it e.q., effects, method of sampling? Is this a choice by manufacturers as to how they make the drums sound, or is it a technology that some have and others do not? Is it the way they are arranged or used in styles? It would seem that Yamaha has more money than all the rest combined, so should be able to make the drums sound any way they want.
DonM
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#123073 - 01/06/02 02:47 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Eric, B Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/15/99
Posts: 2028
Loc: Ventura, Ca, USA
Great song. I liked it a lot.
UD I do think that american and european taste in music is quite different. I just spend a month in Europe and the music on the radio is very different, except for a few international artists like Cher
Madona, Elton John, Phil Collins etc.

A lot of american musicians that you have never heared about in the US are big in Europe, because nobody wants to listen to their music here.

Eric
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#123074 - 01/06/02 05:18 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Bluezplayer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2195
Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY
John,

I too like the song quite a bit. I agree that the PA80 really gives us some good sounds to work with, particularly in the area of drums.

Don,
I often ask myself the same question about the sampling methods used by different manufacturers. Some of the Yamaha sounds are really good, while others aren't so good. even though I prefer the Korg sounds overall when comparing between my 2 arrangers, the Korg acoustic pianos don't do anything for me, and neither do a lot of the acoustic string sounds. Having dabbled in sampling myself a bit though, I'm sure the techs have to put a good bit of effort into getting the sample to sound right, not to mention all of the EQ and synth editing you can do afterwards, and because sounds are such a subjective thing anyway, I'm guessing that what sounds good to the Korg tech might not sound quite as good to the Yamaha or Roland tech, etc etc...

Eric,

I agree that the music that one can hear played on the radio here in the US is somewhat different from that which might be heard outside of the US. Maybe it is because we have different tastes in music but maybe part of that is also because we are bombarded here with similar genres and types of popular music over and over, year after year. I'm not entirely convinced that all of it has to do with our tastes though. Radio is big business in the US, and there are many stations that are owned by a relatively few large companies throughout the different markets in the US, and even many of the independent ones use syndicated programming as well. Station owners and managers are of course concerned with the bottom line ( and rightfully so..it is business....), but there are not many risk takers among them because of it. Proven formats usually guarantee good advertising revenue, which in turn makes for a good bottom line. I can go to any area of the US and find that the top 40 playlist or the smooth jazz playlist ( etc etc ) is nearly identical in every major market. There is more diversity on the lower end of the frequency spectrum ( 88-92 mhz) as these frequencies are reserved for college and other non commercial broadcasters, but even many of those are tied to large independent groups such as NPR. It saddens me to see that even despite the support shown by the FCC itself to try to allow smaller, independent, and usually low power broadcasters access to the airwaves, the N.A.B. and large networks have continued to influence many politicians in this country to prevent it from happening, arguing that their opposition stems from the potential for harmful interference against their big megastations. The FCC isn't perfect, but they've done a pretty good job in the past of keeping things on the broadcast bands pretty straight thus avoiding those kind of problems, so to me that is a shallow argument. I think it's more about money and greed and the fear of losing a fraction of their advertising revenue. I know this has little to do with arranger kb's and I'm sorry for venting here, but this is truly a subject that invokes a tremendous amount of passion in me, and I feel that the situation really limits the amount of diversity on our airwaves. None of this makes it any easier for relatively unknown bands to get airplay either, although I've strayed far enough from the topic and won't lament the big record companies part in all of that. If the situation were different and we had more choices in what we could listen to, I don't know that the public here as a whole would embrace all or even much of it, but I'd still like to have access to more different types of programming ( therefore different types of music ) available. There are many "microbroadcasters" out there just waiting for the opportunity to do it legally.

AJ



[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 01-06-2002).]
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#123075 - 01/06/02 06:26 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Bill E Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 223
Loc: nashville
John--since I cannot communicate directly with Fabio,please relay to him that I am a big fan. This is the 6th Fabio song for my collection,and all of them are outstanding. Do you have any knowledge of his recording equipment and/or methods? He has loads of talent and taste,and to these ears, He does the best work that I have yet heard done on an arranger.

Don---Yamaha has the ability but I think that they perceive the arranger market to be older, or more of an "easy listening" market,and they may well be right. My complaint with Yamaha is that the drummer sounds "polite"--NOT a trait that I want in a drummer,but I realize that I am in the minority here! I love the way that Yamaha handles the fills and transitions and I just wish that their arranger programmers would learn a bit from their "groovebox" and Motif people! {and their bass player would play more than one note!)

AJ---the radio situation is why I miss Napster so much! I purchased more albums last year than any year since my teens, from artists that I had never heard anywhere else. There is a world of great music out there but one would never know it from what is on most radio stations. Well I guess that I got off topic too!
Bill

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#123076 - 01/06/02 07:54 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
Bill, I have had great success finding songs on Morpheus. They cost the same as the ones on Napster did.
DonM
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#123077 - 01/07/02 01:02 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
john smies Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/05/00
Posts: 1384
Loc: koudekerke, Holland.
For those of you who like Fabio's song check this out: http://www.chez.com/fabiopa80korg/chansonsfabio.htm

john.

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#123078 - 01/07/02 02:20 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Sander Offline
Member

Registered: 01/20/01
Posts: 189
Loc: Hoogeveen, Drenthe, The Nether...
I've listened to it yesterday night and I agree, it sounds great. The PA-80 has a more 'synthy' sound in my opinion than a lot of other arrangers. But this sounded quite good indeed.

Oh.. I forgot; when I publish any song in MP3.. it'll be without a voice, just to save you a pair of ears

Sander

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#123079 - 01/07/02 08:49 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
I know alot of GREAT singers with BAD voices - Jimmy Durante, Rod Stewart, Kermit the frog (Rainbow Connection?)
Singing isn't ALL about the tool (voice) it's more a combination of heart & soul. If the message is felt through the lyrics, then the tone of the voice is not as important.
Seriously.......I'd rather listen to a heartfelt performance by anyone...then a mechanical, lackluster one from a master.
I used to work with a guy that was a good technical singer - he breathed right, he had good control etc...... except I HATED how he sang ! He had no TRUE emotional content in anything he sang. He was always trying to "cop" the sound of the original, and he never put any of himself into the songs.
To this day, I can't understand how he works at all.
So, the message is this - SING, sing, sing !
(at least, give it a good try!)
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#123080 - 01/07/02 10:20 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Eric, B Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/15/99
Posts: 2028
Loc: Ventura, Ca, USA
AJ
well said.

Bill
have you tried Kazaa (www.kazaa.com)
it looks and works very much like Napster.
Check it out. I have downloaded quite a few songs there.

Eric
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#123081 - 01/07/02 11:30 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Here are some other 'after' Napster alternatives. Which one is YOUR favorite?
http://www.afternapster.com/
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#123082 - 01/07/02 11:49 AM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Big Red Offline
Member

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 125
Loc: Canada
Bluezplayer:

Right on! The same or similar situation exists here in Canada, too. Here in Alberta we have a saviour of the airwaves in the shape of CKUA out of Edmonton and Calgary (both FM) and relayed over a bunch of AM transmitters across the province. This is a totally publically-funded station that plays a wonderfully eclectic mix of music. Do yourself a favour and log on to
www.ckua.com

and hear what I mean.
Best regards,
Big Red

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#123083 - 01/07/02 12:03 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Fabio,
Your website and songs are most IMPRESSIVE! Bravo. I agree with Sandro that the PA80 seems to have more of a contemporary synthy sound than other arrangers I've played. Sander, please record your next MP3 and include your vocals too. - Scott
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#123084 - 01/07/02 01:09 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Bill E Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 223
Loc: nashville
Eric,thanks for the tip but it seems that Kazaa is not for Mac,and tho I'm sitting in my sunroom,this is a "Windows"-free house!

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#123085 - 01/07/02 01:46 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Quote:
Originally posted by Scottyee:
[ I agree with Sandro that the PA80 [/B]


Sandro??? Scott, that's freudian! Don't tell me that you are still thinking of the SD1!?!
_________________________
Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#123086 - 01/07/02 04:08 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Andrea: oops sorry , I was referring to our good friend Sander Thalen, not Sandro. Anyway, (speaking of Sandro), I so hope to get a chance to see him at NAMM next week to thank him (in person) for implementing the SD1 rootless chord recognition (even though I ended up going with the PSR2000 ). - Scott
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#123087 - 01/08/02 03:58 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
john smies Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/05/00
Posts: 1384
Loc: koudekerke, Holland.
Fabio has asked me to thank all of you that have somehow responded either to his songs or to his marvellous pa-80 site, and for your kind words.
He was surprised to see, as was I, that the response here on the site far exceeded the response on the actual korg pa-80 discussion site.

john.

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#123088 - 01/08/02 04:15 PM Re: Great Korg PA-80 song by Fabio
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
That's cuz all the really smart people hang out here!
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