it seems members not only rarely post on the forums for Yamaha, Roland, Korg, Ketron et al compared to choosing to post on the General Arranger Forum, they seem to rarely read the posts related to their brand as well, and concentrate on reading the General forum only. i'm wondering why that is so..I can understand general issues and brand comparisons but don't understand why all discussions re a particular keyboard or a group type of a particular brand don't wind up posted and read in the specific forums set up for that

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Miami Mo

It's simple...there's not as much bickering and controversy on the specific brand sites.

Ian

for me, it's because I have the synthzone arranger forum as a bookmark and often just forget to look at the other forums


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George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California
818-881-5566 www.kayesmusicscene.com

[This message has been edited by George Kaye (edited 08-26-2007).]

does anyone think it would be a good/bad idea to require (or at least strongly urge) members to post/read things like "i just got my new GinkoBiloba kb" or "my Fernburner just developed a glitch in the harmonizer" in the respective forums and keep the General Forum limited to general issues and/or items encompassing more than one kb or brand subgroup? If so, please say why. i'm thinking it's a good idea--but it may not be a practicable one. The Technics forum seems unique in that the owners tend to post/read there rather than on the General..seems to work well for them...

I've been here at the Zone for almost 7 years ( 9/1/00 ), and for all that time, people come and go and some try to change the format, the tone, the moderation, the content, etc ........

I'm here to say that Nigel has provided a haven for those of us that like to beat our chest, or offer help, or share a moment with our peers, and I WOULDN'T CHANGE A THING about this place!

Sure, tempers fire up sometimes.
Sure, the pi$$ing contests pop up sometimes.

Through it all ...... I have shared and recieved so much information here that I would be a different person and a different player today, if it were not for my pal Nigel, and my fellow ZONERS !!!!!!!!

Post if you want, don't if you don't, lurk if you must, but use this valuable resourse as it was intended to be: FREE

I just went over for a look at the Korg forum. There is a total of 10 posts...TOTAL. That's less than will be on this thread in the next 30 minutes.

I think it is because there are several good sites on the web that are manufacturer specific, that have better facilities for hosting files, updates, videos and audio demos, have dedicated bug forums, style forums, tips and tricks sections, etc..

Without a more elaborate forum software, SZ is a bit hobbled to provide the support that a true dedicated site can. And these sites have been established for quite a while.

The General Arranger forum here is fairly unique, in that you get a lot of comparison posts, whether polite or not vs. the one-sided viewpoint of the dedicated fora, and hearing how others use their arrangers, and what specific features are the most loved and hated is very informative.

But the SZ specific fora lack the features necessary to make a good resource, compared to other, more established sites. I don't post a lot on the SZ Roland forum because most of what is discussed there is simply a repeat of what has already been discussed at roland-arranger.com, and one can only post the URL so many times...

I just don't see the point of reinventing the wheel... or at least, duplicating it.

let me address each of the issues raised---- 1)i think making suggestions for improvements is always valid, and criticizing and/or rejecting the suggestions is also valid, but saying sz is perfect in every way, and suggestions are unwelcome is arbitrary.----- 2)the Korg forum is an extreme example of non-use, the Technics an extreme example of heavy use. what could be the reasons? 3)diki, you are assuming the specific forum posts on sz are more technical help oriented, and therefore other websites do that better--but a lot of what is on the General forum re specific brands is not technical at all, so why not have those on the special forums instead of clogging up the General with stuff about one kb when the reader owns a different brand? that person can always go the the specific forum if they are interested in learning more about that brand..----4)none of this is really a big deal, we could have everything on the General and be fine with that, and we could have more separation and be fine with that. Just seems to me the way it is now, when I post a question on the Roland forum, the response is so slow and sparse that I'm discouraged from using it at all and so it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy that the specific forums are not the way to get results.

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Miami Mo

case in point, diki--please check my reply to your answer on Roland forum..i want to get hold of that ots program asap..thanks..

I was tempted to start like: Once upon a time......

Regarding the SZ Technics forum, it's probably the fact that the "genuine" Technics forums,
(both Technote and the old Canada much used forums) was pulled down some years ago who are
the main reason.
When Technote forum closed, the users would like to continue discussions and keep contact,
either by start a new forum or find a exsisting place to use.
Some of us was already SZ members, and a request about if the Technics users was welcome to
"move over to SZ" was (as always) very positively responded by Nigel.
Within a very short period of time, most all of the Technote members (and many other Technics
users) found the way to the SZ Technics forum.

And since the Technics keyboards are build to last, I guess the story will continue.....

Happy Posting & Playing
GJ

Question: Is Technic service/parts still available?

The thing is, Mo, if you had posted that question at roland-arranger, rather than here, not only would your answer be immediate, but the program is there for download immediately, the program developer has his own forum on the site where he can answer any of your questions straight away, and you can talk to MANY others that already have the same arranger as you, for longer than you, and may have already worked out the workarounds you are struggling with.

I do not feel that, just because I post at the SZ General Arranger forum, I have any obligation to support the SZ Roland forum, when a better one already exists. It is not like a real neighborhood, where you want to support the locals - on the web, there is NO 'local' anything. So I have no problem coming to SZ for my dose of fun (that's all I really ever get from here, it's not as if many of the threads actually discuss anything much more than 'My keyboard right or wrong'), posting a few things to stir stuff up (which doesn't take a whole lot here, as sensitive to criticism of their gear or their attitudes most supposed 'pros' are in here! ) and then popping over to roland-arranger, where we actually get stuff DONE (checked out the details about the 'random pan' undocumented feature, yet?).

Just because it has 'SZ' on it, doesn't mean we really have any obligation to make it work, when years of effort (and quite a bit of money) have already made the best site for Roland arranger discussion (in English) a simple click away. If you want to hang out with your friends (or at least, members here at SZ that you are used to), that's fine. Do that on the SZ General forum. But if you want to hang out where the most E60 users hang out, well, that's roland-arranger.com.

Like I said, why duplicate the wheel..? I can't honestly think of anything we could do on the SZ Roland forum that isn't ALREADY going on over at roland-arranger.com, and I know of LOTS of things going on there that CAN'T be done here. So, as you noticed, I don't check in very often at SZ Roland, and my reply to you there was something of an exception. In future, I would prefer not to have to go trolling through a variety of forums, to answer posts and help, if I can, so if you can, please post at roland-arranger for the fastest response time.

Diki, are you sure you didn't leave anything out? there is still some more space on this thread for you to go into more permutations of your thesis if you really try..anyway, since i do want that ots program you mentioned ON THE SZ ROLAND FORUM,(how did that happen?) I'll go over to spend more time on roland-arranger.com as you suggest. thanks.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Diki:
[B] as sensitive to criticism of their gear or their attitudes most supposed 'pros' are in here!

...You are including yourself, aren't you?

Actually, zuki, I am probably the biggest critic of my own gear here... I moderate the G70 Bug Forum at Roland-Arranger.com (now mostly inactive after two MAJOR OS upgrades) and am probably the largest single poster of suggestions for OS improvements and new functions (several of which have been included by Roland in new OS updates) on the wishlist forum there... This is probably the biggest difference between me and Ian. We both love our particular arrangers, but I am the only one prepared to offer up ANY criticism of it. OTOH, I don't work in any capacity for Roland, so I may just be less shackled in posting my thoughts.

It is just a shame that some here cannot brook ANY criticism of the equipment they play. Recognizing it's faults, and working towards getting them rectified is probably the best use of these fora, but when the cheering section does their level best to drown out any serious discussion, some very valid points just get lost in the constant bickering.

If the gear you have is perfect FOR YOU, why get so defensive if others find it less so themselves? Let them discuss it without ridiculing their concerns. No amount of criticism will make that arranger any less perfect for you. The fact that Ian and yourself don't find yourselves in the overwhelming majority when it comes to opinions about the 'feel' of the PSR line's keybed has not stopped you posting to deny it every single post it is ever mentioned.

If my constant (well, a little less so, these days!) whining for a Chord Sequencer is tedious, how do you think most of us with a more, shall we say, critical approach to the PSR 'feel' regard your incessant denial of any possibility of a problem? The truth is, for most posters here, the PSR's key feel is almost the ONLY criticism, and even THAT you can't abide...

Feel free to of course, pop your little two cents worth in EVERY single time this flaw is discussed, but don't expect anyone to take your decidedly minority opinion any more seriously than most others take mine about the Chord Sequencer. Of course, probably a vastly greater number of players have actually run their hands over a PSR keyboard than have ever tried to figure out the CS, but what the hey... A disliked 'feature' is a disliked feature, no matter how much WE like them....

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 08-27-2007).]

You know, Mo, there are probably better ways to get the help you ask for than kicking in the teeth of those that offer it. You certainly know how to make someone that DID offer support at a forum he doesn't normally post at feel like an idiot for doing so...

You might not want to spend much time at roland-arranger, though. It is a MUCH more actively moderated site than here, and that kind of attitude and ingratitude may get you kicked quite quickly...

Sorry about the lack of brevity. I just haven't figured out how to communicate effectively with emoticons like so many here do... Not that communicating effectively is held in any regard by most, these days. But for someone that hasn't yet figured out that paragraphs can help make a longer post more readable, feel free to keep grading my papers, professor...

If you mean censored .... maybe so. I do moderate but I try not to be invasive that's all.

Diki,

There is a difference between being critical and flaming.

Lately you've been doing more of the latter.

But, that's okay buddy, we PSR owners have broad shoulders and we can take it.

Besides, bubbles aren't harmful...just amusing.

Ian

It is a bit silly of me to defend an instrument - you're probably correct. So I'll try to control my excitement for the 3K and future S900 and just keep going to my gigs (3 today). Diki - have you heard the multi pads in the 900? - I know you miss that feature.

You know, Zuki, you are right...it is a bit silly to keep defending our keyboards.

They are what they are, and they continue to serve you and I (and many others) very well in our endeavors, be what they may.

What is reassuring is that neither of us feel the need to be critical in return.

I guess being secure in what we play and how we play it gives us that great advantage.

Glad you're lookin' at a new S900...you won't be disappointed.

Even though Yamaha has not verified a new action, I do notice a difference from the 3k.

Of course, one must remember that these keyboards cost FAR less than the TOTL arrangers, yet give the same quality sound and feel...they are truly a huge bang for the buck.

I believe the only people in denial, are the ones who can't (or won't) recognize a great instrument when they see (or play) one.

Ian

Diki, kicking you in the teeth is not exactly how i'd describe what i said, and ingratitude in the face of advice wasn't my intention either. i apologize if it came out that way, because if you recall, i have always been one of your staunchest defenders (as well as critics)and i have always profusely thanked you publicly for your help. having problems with lack of brevity is not the whole of it--a lot of the time it comes out as badgering, and the sometimes overly repetive and detailed manner of it can be construed as insulting the intelligence of the reader. i can tend to be long-winded myself at times, even though i have always had the gift of being concise as well. i suggest you take a tip from me now, this is what i try to do when i sometimes get into the knee-jerk reaction to spill out a ton: after you let your fingers type out all the things you want to get off your chest in your replies, do that--it's good for the psyche--but DON'T send it right away. wait a few minutes at least, look back through it. Every time i do this I wind up cutting my replies down severely or completely rewriting it in more concise form from a different perspective, or sometimes not sending any reply at all. As far as my replies being run-on in design, i apologize to all for that. I have a mac, when i use Safari as in the past, often my stuff comes came out with long and short lines whenever i went back in to redo sentences, it looked so sloppy. So i started using Firefox, which seemingly, no matter how much i try to indent, space, and create paragraphs, just won't cooperate and everything comes out as one: hard to read but at least it looks neater than with Safari. If you or anyone else has suggestions how i can get it done better, i'm all ears. Peace, bro

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Miami Mo

I do, I do.....but then we wouldn't be friends anymore. Kidding. Now that we know that you're an ol' geezer (like most of the rest of us), we can afford to be a little more tolerant . Being crochety comes with the territory (ask my wife).

They say that sometimes, silence can speak volumes; in the case of you, me, and Diki, it should probably be "speaking volumes begs silence" .

In any case, it's abundantly clear that the three of us are infinitely smarter than everyone else on this board and the other members need to respect that. (watch some moron respond to that last sentence as though it was sincere). Hey, if Donny, Fran, and Uncle Dave can be the 'Three Amigos', we could be, uh, let's see, the three Musky Tears?

chas

PS: Did you know that Korg spelled backwards is Grok.

...good one, chas.

You make a fine pair, the three of you.

looc si ahamay

Ian

but dnalor skcus

chas

Careful...you'll incur the wrath of narf.

I always click on at very top ACTIVE TOPICS FOR TODAY which displays all latest articles and reply's regardless of brand listing. No need to select individual forums.

Guess the right place to ask would be Panasonic, or Matsushita to see
if there are any parts left in stock at all.
The yellow light are probably steady, if it's not signal red already!

Maybe some local repairshops have something, but the best shot are
probably to buy a used keyboard to have as a private sparepart store.

I have to admit that I did think to do just that, but since I don't have
Technics keyboard anymore, it's not nessesary.

Happy Playing
GJ